Cooling Mod

Just a thought on the whole heating problem how about a plastic vent that not only vents but pulls air into the radiators!

As it would be attached to the side fairing the 1st finn sits higher then the bottom scouping the air and directing the fresh air directly into the radiator.

See attached but very rough, very rough drawing!!

If you have any thoughts or mods to my drawing please let me know.
I've drew this up to show that not only does it scoup air in at low speeds, but still allows air to be sucked in by the fans when stuck in traffic. But as you can see allows the hot air to escape just as much as the air gets forced in.

So once again if you have any thoughts or better ideas on this design please all opinions are welcome as we all ride the same machines!

Cheers

[luckyscrewz]

Might also be worth looking at a way to direct air over the oil cooler which curiously enough is tucked up so high in the body work on my 6th gen that I don't see how any air can *flow* over the fins.

I thought that my 93 had a small black plastic air dam under the headlights that directed air up to the oil cooler.... any 3rd geners out their that can validate this?

[luckyscrewz]

what about running an inline coolant cooler (I run this on my LT450R) - I believe on the VFR we could run two of these one on each side. They claim a 5-degree advantage with one. At least in theory we could expect a 10 degree decrease in temps with two... though I would be ecstatic with 5-degrees at this point.

As in the drawing the upper finns are curved down toward the rad, so as the air gets pushed in, it also helps push or flow the hot air out and away from the engine. This is of course theory. So basically it scoupes the air in and as it is scouped in the theory is air being scouped in is also pushing the hot air out!

[drewl]

My biggest issue is at slow or no speed.
When riding at a decent pace, the system does it's job.
When not moving so fast, it heats up in a hurry.
So...another fan on the opposite side would seem to do the most good for what I have noticed. Or, as others suggested, a lower temp fan switch.
The fan switch would be easy enough to change, it only screws into the one radiator. The extra fan would be difficult due to the need for another mounting system and wiring and electricity.

Now granted touch wood I have not had any major heat problems but I thought I would just see what I could do to help vent the engine better. Without adding an extra fan in doing so draining more power from the battery and of course my R/R blowing out on me!

Cheers

[Y2Kviffer]

I'm thinking of mounting a small fan in front of the oil cooler and hooking up to turn on and off with the key.

[luckyscrewz]

Thats a great idea... I wounder if a small shroud would be required to improve the efficiency of the fan?

I also think I am going to pick up two more of the inline coolers and install them on the VFR and see if that helps

[mello dude]

Hard to tell from your drawing - but if you are forcing air thru the radiators into the engine bay you would be fighting the natural cooling of air in the front and out the sides.

I have seen some slats across the outside of the radiators sold for the RC51. They are supposed to create negative pressure to the outside and therefore force more air thru the system.

What are those inline cooler things?

Drewl - VFR800Canuck added a 3 row oil cooler on his to drop temps - just another idea. Cooler oil could help some. Even add a larger capasity automotive oil filter.
Still back at the super hawk fan. Did you check the VFRD thread?
MD

[mello dude]

Originally Posted by luckyscrewz

what about running an inline coolant cooler (I run this on my LT450R) - I believe on the VFR we could run two of these one on each side. They claim a 5-degree advantage with one. At least in theory we could expect a 10 degree decrease in temps with two... though I would be ecstatic with 5-degrees at this point.

Lucky - what are these things? Got a link?

Thanks,
MD

[powerslave]

So,are you trying to push the air IN towards the engine through the rads in your design??
From what I always understood the fairings and side-mounted rads ard designed to scoop air in from behind the front wheel and OUT the side of the fairing.

[NorcalBoy]

The issue seems to be that:

1. Not enough air passes through the radiator when sitting idle or barely moving.......

2. The auxiliary fan switch fails to engage the fan at a low enough temp, thus the coolant temps become elevated before the fan activates. This issue also makes it harder for the fan to adequately flow enough air to quickly dissipate any additional heat, when not assisted by vehicle movement.

3. Scoops only work when the vehicle is moving.........

I believe the answer lies in the fan switch thermo engagement point or the efficiency of the fan.......take a good look at the right side radiator on a 6th gen......try getting a decent fan behind it or in front of it.......not much room to play with there.....

[Rev]

If you want it to run cooler at idle or low speed situations, you could replace the fan switch with one that operates at a lower temperature. I seem to recall a thread on this or VFRD a while back about swapping them out and which one to use.

[Rustbucket]

IIRC the low temp fan switch was really low - like 187 or so... I'm too lazy to search and make this a genuinely useful post though.

It seems to me the fix(es) would be to reverse the direction of the existing fan as has been discussed here and on VFRD, and look into adding a second fan on the right radiator. If you check out performance auto parts sellers like Summit Racing - High Performance Car and Truck Parts | 800-230-3030, there are electric fans available that are less than 2" thick. they come with nifty zip-tie type doodads to attach to the radiator, so mounting wouldn't be a problem.

[Fizz]

Originally Posted by luckyscrewz

what about running an inline coolant cooler (I run this on my LT450R) - I believe on the VFR we could run two of these one on each side. They claim a 5-degree advantage with one. At least in theory we could expect a 10 degree decrease in temps with two... though I would be ecstatic with 5-degrees at this point.

I can see that cooler helping under extended durations of high output or excessive sitting, as the coolant may never actually get cool enough to have the thermostat close.

However, if I understand liquid cooling systems (which I'm probably missing a lot) I think that under normal circumstances, said cooler will make no difference in coolant temperature. The engine and cooling system are designed to operate within certain optimal temperatures; not too cold, not too hot. When the engine/coolant is cold, the thermostat is closed, causing the coolant to not flow and allow the engine to warm the volume of coolant surrounding the heads. Once the coolant reaches the opening threshold, the thermostat opens allowing cool(er) coolant into the heads; this process is essentially rinse and repeat.

In other words, the thermostat (when working correctly) is going to keep the coolant at the optimum temperature (whatever that may be). The cooler will help dissipate heat once it's built up and the thermostat is staying wide open, but for the most part; the cooler will make little difference.

[CARMINE]

A simple manual switch. That's the way I have no more problems about temp. with my old '87 VFR. When the temp.gauge is at half scale I turn on the manual switch to activate the fan before to reach the red zone. Simple and efficient, at a very cheap price (the price of an electrical switch). I mounted it in the left front fairing hole. Easy to be reached but hidden.
Lamps to all VFR owners.

[luckyscrewz]

Originally Posted by mello dude

What are those inline cooler things?

They were so far as I know designed for quads -- you cut the hose between the motor and the radiator and install the cooler inline (finned aluminum insert)... the piece has cooling fins machined into it which act as a tiny radiator. They seem to do the trick well on my quad (fan kicks on less often) and I assume they would have a similar impact on the VFR. They come in multiple colors which ads a bit of bling while helping cool the motor (at least in theory).

[luckyscrewz]

Originally Posted by mello dude

Lucky - what are these things? Got a link?

Thanks,
MD

I bought mine here:

Rocky Mountain ATV/MC

Intended use is for a quad... I know my 450 can churn up an amazing amount of heat in a hurry causing the fan to run nearly full time. With this little cooler installed it *seems* that the fan takes longer to kick on and runs less often.

I need to check the tube diameter to verify that these will fit If so I will be ordering two for my VFR (one for each side)

[Rustbucket]

I'm no engineer, but it seems like compared to the oil cooler already fitted, that wouldn't add much additional cooling area... Does your quad have an oil cooler stock? How big is it? I've gotta think that going to a 3-row cooler would be more effective.

Of course, for $50 bucks someone could always pick up a few and let us know how they work!

[mello dude]

Originally Posted by luckyscrewz

I bought mine here:

Rocky Mountain ATV/MC

Intended use is for a quad... I know my 450 can churn up an amazing amount of heat in a hurry causing the fan to run nearly full time. With this little cooler installed it *seems* that the fan takes longer to kick on and runs less often.

I need to check the tube diameter to verify that these will fit If so I will be ordering two for my VFR (one for each side)

Looked at the site - interesting idea. Kind of a in line radiator. Theres no listing of diameters though. Maybe stick one on the cross hose?

MD

[mello dude]

Originally Posted by Rustbucket

I'm no engineer, but it seems like compared to the oil cooler already fitted, that wouldn't add much additional cooling area... Does your quad have an oil cooler stock? How big is it? I've gotta think that going to a 3-row cooler would be more effective.

Of course, for $50 bucks someone could always pick up a few and let us know how they work!

I think if I lived in an area where 90 - 100 degree temps were normal for summer I would add a 3 row oil cooler vs the 5th gen 2 row. 6th gens went to 3 rows.

If you are luck enuff to find a 2nd gen cooler (1986) - its very close to a drop-in.
link
veefer800canuck/Oil cooler mods - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Credit to veefer800canuck - very sharp tech dude.

MD

[Rubo]

Originally Posted by CARMINE

A simple manual switch. That's the way I have no more problems about temp. with my old '87 VFR. When the temp.gauge is at half scale I turn on the manual switch to activate the fan before to reach the red zone. Simple and efficient, at a very cheap price (the price of an electrical switch). I mounted it in the left front fairing hole. Easy to be reached but hidden.
Lamps to all VFR owners.

that's the best idea!!! Switch the fan before it gets too hot.I often get stock in traffic and start getting real nevous watching that temp go 200 210 225!! and me
I hate that...
Could you post how you did it?

[abner malidy]

Originally Posted by Rubo

that's the best idea!!! Switch the fan before it gets too hot.I often get stock in traffic and start getting real nevous watching that temp go 200 210 225!! and me
I hate that...
Could you post how you did it?

rubo, i added a very simple 2 position switch to control the fan on my G1.

off = totally stock automatic fan operation.
on = manual fan control to turn fan on NOW

if i am coming into stop and go area, i just switch to fan ON before the temp even starts to rise.

when i add a switch to my new G5, i will get a nicer switch with an indicator lite to give a visual indication that the fan is ON as a mode reminder.

it was maybe $5 for a switch and some decent wire, and took maybe an hour to install the setup on the 1st bike. im sure the actual install would take less then 30 min for the 2nd install. i mounted the switch on the upper left fairing "cover" plate on the G1. i have not yet decided on a location for the G5 as this bike is brand new to me.

[CARMINE]

Hi Rubo,
Abner's system is a very good one. Mine is less elaborated because Fan Thermoswitch (on the radiator) was faulty. So, this is the way I built my manual switch :
1. Disconnect wire from the thermoswitch (it is a +) (the fan takes ground on the rad body).
2. Connect a wire with a male plug (about 10 cm) to the wire above (point 1)
3. Connect the other end of the wire to an unipole switch (on/off), (shape and color at your desire)
4. Connect another 10 cm wire (check this lenght) at the other end of the switch.
5. The wire at point 4. will be grounded (I grounded it under a screw fixing a cover existing bertween tank and left side fairing).
6. Put the switch well in the left fairing hole so that you can reach it but it will be hidden and out of the reach of the rain....
That's all. Of course my original thermoswitch is there on the rad without connection.
When you turn off the ignition key the fan will be stopped anyway.
Good job ! Ciao,
Carmine

[pfbmgd]

What is considered normal operating temperature?

What is considered hot ?

[jobvfr]

My 01 runs 178-190 on the highway, but quickly goes up in stop and go traffic. The highest I've ever seen is 230, but apparently the danger zone is 250 or so.

Does the 3 row cooler from a vtec vfr easily fit?
Or is a big job?
Anyone?

[pfbmgd]

Mine runs 190-195 on the HWY .

[Banderso]

I got a 01 RC51 5pass oil cooler coming. Gonna replace the three pass one on my 99.
We shall see...

[mello dude]

Originally Posted by Banderso

I got a 01 RC51 5pass oil cooler coming. Gonna replace the three pass one on my 99.
We shall see...

Stocker oil cooler on a 5th gen is 2 pass. Stocker on a 6th is 3 pass.

5 pass? Hmmmmm, optimum oil temp is 180 to 200 degrees fahrenheit. I would wonder if the oil would run too cool?

MD

[hondajt]

airflow is a funny thing. you need to be careful.

There is a real science to air flow dynamics. Just by adding another vent, it doesn't mean you will get more airflow. The low-high pressure thing is complicated.