Michelin Pilot Road 2 tires...first impressions

[Puma Cat]

I put 200+ miles on the Michelin Pilot Road 2 tires today on my 5th Gen VFR.

Here is the pertinent data and my impressions after a full day of riding.

Model: '99 5th Gen
Particulars:
Ohlins HO801 rear shock with 40 mm rider sag, compression at factory setting, rebound at 15 clicks out from max.
Front fork: 44 mm rider sag, forks revalved by Dan Kyle with 9.0 Newton-meter springs, forks raised in triples 3mm from stock setting

Tire pressure: 33 F/35 R Ambient temps were approx. 61-64 degrees F.

Ride: 200 miles of back roads in Northern California, Lake Berryessa, Silverado Trail, Alexander Valley areas. Freeway up to twisty bits.

First impressions were on the Freeway up to the good bits. The overall impression was that the steering was notably lighter and more neutral than the Pilot Power front and Metzeler Sportec M1 rear (I know, a screwy combination, it's what the bike came with when I bought it), but not unstable in any way. The rear tires must have a larger circumference than the Metzeler, and the bike is slighly taller geared. A 73-74 mph, I am turning 5000 rpm in 6th gear compared to 70 mph previously at 5K rpm. Fine with me.

The overall impression on our crap concrete freeways is that the ride quality is really, really nice. The tires feel like the way the Ohlins shock makes the rear suspension feel....supple and comfortable, but perfectly controlled. Really impressive. The supple, but controlled ride quality is quite unlike anything i've ever experienced, but in a word, wonderful.

In the twisties, in cold, sometimes damp roads, the tires steer and corner beautifully. Plenty of grip, very neutral steering with great feel. The VFR feels lighter and more nimble than ever, but just as stable and confidence inspiring as always. I rode today on colder, more damp conditions almost as fast as I ever do on my F4i on these roads in the summer, and the tires performed beautifully.

The combination of neutrality, feedback, grip and outstanding ride quality is very impressive. I am going to put these sport touring tires on my 600s for canyon sport riding. Given the mileage (which should be at least double) that these dual-compound tires will get compared to a more sport-oriented tire, they will be a much better value than the traditional sport tires I've been running (Sportec M1s). I can see why John451 mentioned in another post that retailers in Sydney, Australia have seen a dropoff of Sportec M3 and Pilot Power tire sales since these came out. They are that good....

All in all, so far, I think these are the most impressive street tires I have ever ridden, and a sport touring tire at that. As John said, in another post, they are bloody brilliant....

[PorscheBob]

Puma, thanks for the heads-up. I am getting close to getting new tires and was leaning towards these.

Now I am certain that these Michelins are the tires I want.

I've been using dual-compound Bridgestones and don't particularly like them

Now fill them with nitrogen and enjoy...

[John451]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

The overall impression was that the steering was notably lighter and more neutral than the Pilot Power front good....

Found that also, they probably don't turn in quite as quick as the Powers but they are Neutral in a nice way.

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

All in all, so far, I think these are the most impressive street tires I have ever ridden, and a sport touring tire at that.

Glad you like them, wouldn't have recommended R2's so highly except for those I've ridden with raving incessantly about them in the first place. I'm jealous of your Ohlins, must finish that new shock business case to the missus....

[Bunky]

I ordered the PR2's in the beginning of December. I didn't know it at the time of ordering, but they were on backorder until January. By the middle of Februrary, they still had not shipped, so I gave up and went with the Avon Storm's.

I'm getting them mounted this week along with the harness recall service.I hope I can post a similar review once I get a chance to ride them.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by John451

Found that also, they probably don't turn in quite as quick as the Powers but they are Neutral in a nice way.

And the fact that they don't turn in as quick as the Powers is fine with me...I like stability in my bikes. The slower steering overall before the tire swap was probably due to the fact that the Metzeler Sportec M1 rear was flat down the middle, and the front sat too high when the higher spring rate springs were installed. That is why I raised the forks 3 mm.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by PorscheBob

Puma, thanks for the heads-up. I am getting close to getting new tires and was leaning towards these.

Now I am certain that these Michelins are the tires I want.

I've been using dual-compound Bridgestones and don't particularly like them

Now fill them with nitrogen and enjoy...

Why should I fill them with nitrogen? Air is 76% nitrogen already.

Also, the temperature change for all gases is the same, PV=nRT, acc. to the Ideal Gas Law.

[Lgn001]

Hi, Puma. By any chance, do the new tires make any noise? I know that sounds strange, but I have a set of Pilot Roads (old version) on my SV, and the front actually makes a bit of road noise. They seem to be wearing well (6K plus), except for the back getting slightly flattened in the middle (lots of highway miles). I've never had a motorcycle tire make noise before, so I am just curious.

[NorcalBoy]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

Why should I fill them with nitrogen? Air is 76% nitrogen already.

Also, the temperature change for all gases is the same, PV=nRT, acc. to the Ideal Gas Law.

Good job on the physics formula!

The reason that race teams use nitrogen instead of compressed air isn't for the reason you seem to think it is........Race teams use nitrogen because of MOISTURE. Compressed air contains water vapor, so when tires reach a temperature of 212 degrees this water water vapor turns into steam.....making the tire pressure inconsistent. N2 is used because it does not have the inherent moisture problems of compressed air. Just something to think about.....

[elf800]

what size tires did you put on?? i was wondering if i put a 200/50/17 rear if it change the handling, i like the look of the big tires front id leave stock size. 180/55/17 120/70/17 r what my bike came with stock 07 rwb handles fine but the wider back may slow the flickability?? i love the michellins i think they r worth the money but the old dunlop 208's on my old gsxer were fantastic.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by NorcalBoy

Good job on the physics formula!

The reason that race teams use nitrogen instead of compressed air isn't for the reason you seem to think it is........Race teams use nitrogen because of MOISTURE. Compressed air contains water vapor, so when tires reach a temperature of 212 degrees this water water vapor turns into steam.....making the tire pressure inconsistent. N2 is used because it does not have the inherent moisture problems of compressed air. Just something to think about.....

Thanks. For riding The Pace on the street, these concerns are probably a moot point. BTW, there is no difference between water vapor and steam, steam IS water vapor, just at a higher temperature than ambient water vapor, it's just water vapor at greater than 100 deg. C. And as a gas, water, like all gases, behave identically with respect to temperature with respect to the Ideal Gas Law. If, on the other hand, there was some LIQUID water in the compressed air, then as the tire temp increased, this water would go to the gaseous state, and result in an increase in n, the no. of moles of gas (in the equation PV=nRT) in the the tires, thereby increasing the pressure by this small no. of moles from the liquid water. My guess is that the pressure rise concomitant with this amount of liquid water would be negligible, especially with the 'ole smoothie, Puma Cat, at the helm.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by elf800

what size tires did you put on?? i was wondering if i put a 200/50/17 rear if it change the handling, i like the look of the big tires front id leave stock size. 180/55/17 120/70/17 r what my bike came with stock 07 rwb handles fine but the wider back may slow the flickability?? i love the michellins i think they r worth the money but the old dunlop 208's on my old gsxer were fantastic.

Stock sizes, 180/55-17 R, 120/70-17 F. I would not put the 200 on the rear, it will mess with the handling.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by Lgn001

Hi, Puma. By any chance, do the new tires make any noise? I know that sounds strange, but I have a set of Pilot Roads (old version) on my SV, and the front actually makes a bit of road noise. They seem to be wearing well (6K plus), except for the back getting slightly flattened in the middle (lots of highway miles). I've never had a motorcycle tire make noise before, so I am just curious.

What kind of noise? I think I hear some sound when hitting a Botts Dot, and there seems to be bit of noise on VERY rough (choppy and fragmented) pavement, but other than that, no...can you describe the sound and conditions when you hear it.

[NorcalBoy]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

Thanks. For riding The Pace on the street, these concerns are probably a moot point. BTW, there is no difference between water vapor and steam, steam IS water vapor, just at a higher temperature than ambient water vapor, it's just water vapor at greater than 100 deg. C. And as a gas, water, like all gases, behave identically with respect to temperature with respect to the Ideal Gas Law. If, on the other hand, there was some LIQUID water in the compressed air, then as the tire temp increased, this water would go to the gaseous state, and result in an increase in n, the no. of moles of gas (in the equation PV=nRT) in the the tires, thereby increasing the pressure by this small no. of moles from the liquid water. My guess is that the pressure rise concomitant with this amount of liquid water would be negligible, especially with the 'ole smoothie, Puma Cat, at the helm.

My reply was based upon you 76% statement, not on the viability or applicability with respect to street bike tires or your riding.......

I believe that the water in compressed air is a vapor and then will recondense into liquid upon introduction into the tire under lower pressure.....I'm sure you will correct me as I know how this works.......

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by NorcalBoy

My reply was based upon you 76% statement, not on the viability or applicability with respect to street bike tires or your riding.......


I believe that the water in compressed air is a vapor and then will recondense into liquid upon introduction into the tire under lower pressure.....I'm sure you will correct me as I know how this works.......

Ahh, soo...all is crear now, sensei. Aregato...

Heheheh. Did you get out and ride today????

I was just in Jimtown and Geyserville on 128...it is absolutely beautiful out. At the moment, I am sitting in St. Helena at the Coffee Roastery, having a ginger snap, some Orangina, the VFR parked outside, patiently awaiting further riding....

[NorcalBoy]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

Ahh, soo...all is crear now, sensei. Aregato...

Heheheh. Did you get out and ride today????

I was just in Jimtown and Geyserville on 128...it is absolutely beautiful out. At the moment, I am sitting in St. Helena at the Coffee Roastery, having a ginger snap, some Orangina, the VFR parked outside, patiently awaiting further riding....

I am not liking you right now, because you have ridden all weekend and I am still waiting to assemble a pile of parts that I don't have, LOL!

I wish I could get this damn thing done! I do take some comfort in the fact that, at least, you were able to get out and enjoy some fine Norcal days on your new skins! I will hopefully be joining you at some point very soon! Are you planning on doing the BBQ?

Sorry, totally off topic........

[John451]

Originally Posted by Lgn001

do the new tires make any noise? I know that sounds strange, but I have a set of Pilot Roads

I'm not sure you can compare the Road with the Road 2 as the R2's have a completely new tread pattern and are a much newer technology tyre, I haven't noticed my Front R2 being noisy although haven't tried them with ear plugs out on our back roads coarse tar mix.

Old Road Tread pattern:


New Road 2 Tread Pattern: