1986 VFR700F electric conversion

[strangeintp]

hmmm now you've got me thinking...

When I bought the bike, it came with spare:

frame,
forks,
wheels,
sprockets,
1/2 seat (seat and subframe had been modded, unfortunately I already threw the chopped up subframe away)

Seems like that's enough to start an EV bike project with, no?
I'll need a subframe eventually.

[frodus]

do it man!

You can basically build it off what I have done if you want... might use different batteries, but yeah... Use a simlar motor, same mounting points, same style battery tray and you could mold a new cover for where the gas tank goes. Its been a fun project. If you decide to do it, I'll let you blog on evfr.net and post pictures to the gallery.

Just make sure its got a titled frame. Subframes come up on ebay alot, under $100. The rest is just to make it look perty. I've got some old brakes front and rear if you need them, as well as a rear shock that could be used until you get a new one.

[frodus]

So, she's actually running now. Click the pic below for the blog entry and some pictures. I posted a video, but its dark. I'll get more tonight and throw it up on youtube. I'll do a walkaround as well. Looks like frankenbike, but it'l be cleaned up. We just wanted to get it together so we can begin testing.

[SLOVFR]

Nice!, I cant get the Video to play yet but good job on sticking to the project..

[drewl]

Holy crap, man. You've done it. Have you included the recording of the V4 engine? It is not a VFR without it, you know.
Looking forward to the videos.

[frodus]

I'll get them up on youtube tonight... it was 11pm last night when we took video, and you can't see anything...

I'll post more tonight (might be late).

Thanks for the support too... I've wanted this since August when the whole conversation about the Tesla Roadster peaked my interest... and I decided to get a bike.

I took my first ever streetbike ride last night too...only rode dirtbikes (a handful of times) when i was younger. The COG is LOW, and it turns pretty easy. Its not very top heavy, so we'll see how high speed turning is without the countersteer effect being as pronounced.

Pickup was "decent" but needs tweaking.

its an ongoing process, and very unknown territory.

[mello dude]

I'll get them up on youtube tonight... it was 11pm last night when we took video, and you can't see anything...

I'll post more tonight (might be late).

Thanks for the support too... I've wanted this since August when the whole conversation about the Tesla Roadster peaked my interest... and I decided to get a bike.

I took my first ever streetbike ride last night too...only rode dirtbikes (a handful of times) when i was younger. The COG is LOW, and it turns pretty easy. Its not very top heavy, so we'll see how high speed turning is without the countersteer effect being as pronounced.

Pickup was "decent" but needs tweaking.

its an ongoing process, and very unknown territory.

Keep at it, Frodus.. I'm routing for you. It would be very cool to have a electric vehicle to plug into the wall to drive to work.

MD

[frodus]

Well, its been a fun week. We got it running Tuesday and spent all week trying her out, charging it and running around. Friday I went to the Ducati Dealership near the shop and showed it off, let them take it for a ride, they enjoyed it. There were a couple girls there and they were speachless..... its going to be a geekgirl magnet.

Anyway, I posted some video on youtube.
YouTube - frodus17's Channel

The accel sucks right now because the gearing is low (4:1) and the batteries are used and pretty tired. She scoots pretty well with a full charge.

We're deciding on the next batteries we want to buy (since we have to get a complete new pack to replace the free used bats we got for testing). We'll order a new sprocket from sprocket specialists once we know what kind of power the new pack can put out.

Its ongoing, so don't assume this is all she's got... This video was taken Wednesday. Thursday the batteries were charged, and there was a NOTICEABLE improvement. Then we charged them all the way Thursday night, and there was noticeable improvement again... then we tweaked some settings and there was more improvement. With a higher gear ratio like 5 or 6:1 we'll get more acceleration, less top speed. I'm find topping out around 70, as most of my driving is 50mph or below.

[frodus]

So last night, I dropped by Synkromotive to help Ives with some testing. We tried logging with the DataQ again, and it it kept failing, no matter what setting we used. Nothing seemed to help. We unhooked it, and I’m going to contact Customer Service. We need something to compare our measured values to.

We spent the rest of the evening getting the Old Tachometer (originally fed off the engine spark), to display the current on the motor side. Its pretty cool, as you give it gas, it displays current at a 50A per 1000rpm resolution. So 200A is 4krpm. I’ll likely print something to display actual A, but its great for testing. Its just a PWM signal to the original Tach line. I’m totally cool with keeping the stock look, infact, I’m HOPING to keep as much of a stock look as possible. Now I need to order a PB-6 to keep my original throttle, order a EV200 contactor and get the lights working.

David Boyd got the bike up to 60mph… wow! It was fresh off the pack, and pulled 300A or so up to 30mph, and then it started to drop… at 55mph, it was roughly half of that. Better gearing should help this, as less torque is needed. We’ll keep gearing what it is for now because we’re testing something new every day. I thought it felt kind of like a 250cc, but David said it actually feels more like a 500cc. I think the batteries are waking up a little too, so switching to new ones in the future, with higher current draw is definately going to help. This controller rocks!

I got a jacket the other day, and am going to pick up a Helmet this weekend. Insurance won’t be that hard (My agent has been really cool about helping me). Registering it should be ok, but I’ll have to have someone make sure they see it doesn’t have an exhaust/was converted to electric so I can be excluded from DEQ. I’m also going to get a Motorcycle instruction permit… and keep my riding limited to daytime, with a friend. Just need to take the Knowledge test.

[mello dude]

Um - Are you a new rider?

MD

[frodus]

Streetbikes, yes.

[frodus]

So, I decided to work my butt off this last weekend, and prepare the electric motorcycle for its first official public apearance. the OEVA was sponsoring an EV Awareness day downtown Portland on Saturday. I put everything together, cleaned it up, and went down there. Had a blast. It was one of the more popular vehicles there, because it was the only motorcycle, and the only electric sportbike that I know of in this area!

Read the blog article for details and some pictures!

Just thought everyone would like to see the finished bike. Still have to get it registered and get the lights working, but thats pretty easy stuff. Thanks everyone for the support, its been a long time coming, but the payoff has been great.

[carlgustav]

Very nice. I'm particularly interested as I've been sloooowly prepping an old '82 Kaw 750 frame/running rig for an EV conversion. I'll have to take a closer look at your website when time permits for ideas :^). LiIon is the way to go based on the Killacycle project and some commercially viable auto's. Time to focus on EV is a problem for me, I have a VF and a VFR to play with ;^).

Anders

[mello dude]

So, I decided to work my butt off this last weekend, and prepare the electric motorcycle for its first official public apearance. the OEVA was sponsoring an EV Awareness day downtown Portland on Saturday. I put everything together, cleaned it up, and went down there. Had a blast. It was one of the more popular vehicles there, because it was the only motorcycle, and the only electric sportbike that I know of in this area!

Read the blog article for details and some pictures!

Just thought everyone would like to see the finished bike. Still have to get it registered and get the lights working, but thats pretty easy stuff. Thanks everyone for the support, its been a long time coming, but the payoff has been great.

I apoligise for being a geek but whats it weigh? How far on a charge? How fast can it go? Quick enuff to mix with cars? Recharge time? Looking for better batteries? Would a lighter bike to start make any difference?

MD

[AndyJ]

OK I'm intrigued by this idea! Another geek question-do you have a way to do anything with regenerative braking?
If I had enough guidance, I'd like to try something like this as well (good mechanically, not very electrically competent, but able to follow directions). Keep posting your updates on here if you can, Frodus!

[frodus]

I apoligise for being a geek but whats it weigh?

80-100lbs lighter than stock with lead batteries.

How far on a charge?

15-20 with used lead acid batteries. We got them free and wanted to get testing done on the controller then upgrade batteries when they fell in price.

How fast can it go?

65mph is top speed recorded right now

Quick enuff to mix with cars?

accelerates like a 4-500cc bike

Recharge time?

~4hrs with lead batteries and a 2500Wh pack

Looking for better batteries?

We're going LiFePo this Fall.

Would a lighter bike to start make any difference?

Not a ton, the bike minus engine/exhaust was 140lbs to begin with. Its mostly alum. We might be able to get a newer bike, but this one was VERY cheap to start, and full fairings help. Not sure a lighter bike would change a TON, but we could definitely use more room inside the frame.

[frodus]

OK I'm intrigued by this idea! Another geek question-do you have a way to do anything with regenerative braking?
If I had enough guidance, I'd like to try something like this as well (good mechanically, not very electrically competent, but able to follow directions). Keep posting your updates on here if you can, Frodus!

Series wound motors cannot do regenerative braking with the controllers that are out there. There's "problems" when you try, so its generally better to skip and go to AC.

It was mostly mechanical work, the electrical is fairly easy. Just a bunch of batteries in series, charger, and controller hooked to a motor. I'll try to post a schematic when time permits.

[speed]

i have one question ..... ? is it for sale or are you going to build more ?

[frodus]

i have one question ..... ? is it for sale or are you going to build more ?

I have 2 complete chassis. This one is getting revision 1 equipment. The second one will get the rev 1 equipment, and I'll upgrade this bike with AC.

The second bike will be up for sale eventually, if there is interest. PM me or email me and we can talk. I am also interested in people purchasing "kits" from us... again, if there is interest. Judging from the feedback on here, VFRD and my website (and some other EV sites), I think we might make one kit, and see how it goes from there.

[frodus]

Here's a video that my friend Jim and I shot earlier this week. We have all the fairings on it, and pretty much have the motor mount and battery pack design nailed. We'll be cleaning up the wiring, making some small changes to the mounts, and upgrading the rear sprocket to a 60tooth (ordered 7-18-08).

Right now, I'm working on the custom charging system that will be installed as well as the 12V aux system for lighting.

Real nice shot at the beginning and end of Jim hitting 50mph.

click below:

YouTube - eVFR

[speed]

wow, that really is something cool i wanna know more ?

[frodus]

wow, that really is something cool i wanna know more ?

go here: www.evfr.net

[mello dude]

I have 2 complete chassis. This one is getting revision 1 equipment. The second one will get the rev 1 equipment, and I'll upgrade this bike with AC.

The second bike will be up for sale eventually, if there is interest. PM me or email me and we can talk. I am also interested in people purchasing "kits" from us... again, if there is interest. Judging from the feedback on here, VFRD and my website (and some other EV sites), I think we might make one kit, and see how it goes from there.

Fodus - this is some interesting stuff. The thought of a plug in vehicle is attractive. Do you think the range can go up? My daily commute is 60 miles. If a vehicle could go on a once daily charge - now you got something.

Please keep us up to date on your activitys.

Thanks,
MD

[frodus]

Fodus - this is some interesting stuff. The thought of a plug in vehicle is attractive. Do you think the range can go up? My daily commute is 60 miles. If a vehicle could go on a once daily charge - now you got something.

Please keep us up to date on your activitys.

Thanks,
MD

The range WILL go up... to roughly 40-60 miles (once I upgrade the batteries this fall). Just need to get funds.

Someone on another forum said maybe have a donation paypal for new bats...might not be a bad idea... and I'll put the donors names on the bike.

[kd4ysi]

nice cant wait to see the finished object

[kd4ysi]

meant project

[safetypro10]

Frodus,

Burning question. To increase range, why not use and external transmission, ala HD?

Larry

[frodus]

Frodus,

Burning question. To increase range, why not use and external transmission, ala HD?

Larry

1) it'd be hard to adapt, or impossible to find something that'd couple to a motor like this

2) the RPM range of the motor isn't like that of an ICE, the total usable range is 6krpm, and all the torque is at 0rpm, so at 6krpm, i might be going 70mph or faster, but at 0, I get all my torque. This is usable for me.

3) HP is HP, you still need a certain RPM and Torque to overcome wind resistance. The original engine had 75 or so HP. This is just around 30Hp peak. I won't likely be able to go any faster.

4) the range depends on total power used per given time, so if I have a transmission, the RPM's may be higher allowing more torque,but the average power output would be very similar if I were to have just the motor/sprockets.

5) Simplicity. Its much simpler to have 2 moving parts (motor and wheel with chain coupling them) than it would be to have a transmission/clutch. Its also less lossy.

Hope that answers some Q's.

[safetypro10]

I'm not doing a good job on asking this question.

OK, 6K rpm range. Does power consumed go up as rpm rises? Thats the question.

My thoughts are a simple transmission (since HD uses an external trans, easy) bolted, belted, chained, geared to the motor, would allow good acceleration as well as low power consumption at road speeds? I looking for a way to get that 70 MPH crusing speed and 60-100 mile range and I don't know enough about electric motor power consumption, but most ICE take more gas at higher rpm's. All I remember from EE is volts X amps = power. But is power consumed a function of RPM's turned?

I understand its simpler being direct drive, but sometimes the goal cannot be reached with just a single mechanical object.

Larry

[frodus]

OK, 6K rpm range. Does power consumed go up as rpm rises? Thats the question.

depends on how you're doing the throttle. There's a power curve, and its fairly flat. It very slightly increases. As RPM's increase, the voltage increases, but the current decreases, so power is more constant. If you hammer it, it uses more current, RPM's increase so you're power useage is increased. If you had a transmission, you could lower it a little, but at what cost? You add weight and inefficiency and take up room that could be used for batteries.

My thoughts are a simple transmission (since HD uses an external trans, easy) bolted, belted, chained, geared to the motor, would allow good acceleration as well as low power consumption at road speeds?

You keep saying HD, What is HD? What kind of external transmission are you talking about? You only have so much room for motor and batteries.

I looking for a way to get that 70 MPH crusing speed

I'll have 120V soon, so 70mph isn't going to be too hard. 70mph shouldn't be hard if you chose the right gear ratio.

and 60-100 mile range and I don't know enough about electric motor power consumption

60miles might be doable with some lithium batteries, 100 miles might be a bit of a challenge. The big question, is why do you think you NEED that much range? Is it because you're commute is that far? or is it because you think you need to be able to go that far? Maybe electric isn't for you then, mine is a commuter bike and fun bike, not a long range cruiser. Volume needed for batteries is the big issue. Cars are a little more flexible.

All I remember from EE is volts X amps = power. But is power consumed a function of RPM's turned?

somewhat, each motor has a power curve like this:
http://www.evfr.net/synkromotive/com...motors/K91.pdf

I understand its simpler being direct drive, but sometimes the goal cannot be reached with just a single mechanical object.

my goal was reached :)

I'd likely not get much more of an increase in range. If i had a transmission, and had it in 1st gear, the amps would be lower, but the RPM's would go higher. Then you shift to 2nd, and the rpm's start low, current goes up and then they both start to increase/decrease respectively as your speed increases. Volts x amps = power, so your gains are going to be minimal. Again, you're limited to the HP of the motor.

Keeping the mechanical drag low is important, and keeping extra weight down is equally important. If there was an off the shelf solution that is optimized for an electric motor, I might have used it, but it still isn't as efficient, which is what I need.