'02 VFR - Intermittent starting problem - Looking for ideas

Discussion in 'Mechanics Garage' started by jb9573, Nov 22, 2009.

  1. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    After my bike sits for a few days (4 or 5) and I go to start it, here's what I find. The motor will crank a few times, maybe for a second or so, and then quits cranking. When I let off the starter switch, I hear a click in the starter relay. If I push the starter switch again, often the engine won't crank at all, yet I hear the click from the starter relay. I also hear a high pitch whine coming from lower and farther forward of the starter relay/battery area. Maybe that's the starter motor area but I can't be sure.

    Anyway, if I leave my thumb on the starter switch I hear the high pitch whine that fades to nothing as the headlights and instrument panel are dimming and eventually go dark. Sometimes the motor will start cranking after leaving my finger on the button for several seconds, but often times I have to take my finger on and off the starter switch several times.

    So the bike always starts, but sometimes it just has a little trouble.

    I've researched and think maybe I have a faulty starter motor, but I'm thinking it could be the starter relay switch (or something else).

    I'm looking for opinions on what could be causing the high pitch whine and causing the lights and IP to dim. I think this might point to whether power is making it to the starter motor or not.

    I'm also looking for opinions about what might cause this to happen only after the bike has sat unused for 4-5 days. It never does this once I get to riding the bike on subsequent restarts. And it has never happened the following day after riding the bike.

    A couple of points about the battery worth noting:

    1) The prior owner put an Everstart Maxx battery in it (I understand these aren't the best of batteries).

    2) After keeping the battery on the O'Reilly Shumacher brand battery tender for a few days 3-4, maybe 5, the battery tender starts flashing telling me the battery may be defective.

    Thanks in advance for the help!
    -John
     
  2. TOE CUTTER

    TOE CUTTER Mullet Man

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    Change your battery and inspect the cables.I trust no battery after two years tops.Very cheap part and take it out of the loop.
     
  3. jasonsmith

    jasonsmith Member

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    I say classic symptoms of a dead or soon dead battery.
     
  4. pjvtec

    pjvtec New Member

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    Get a new battery from a dealership. Buy only a Yuasa batery. Do you know if your bike had the stator recall?
     
  5. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    I was told it had been done before I purchased it. What were the symptoms of a bike before recall repairs?
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2009
  6. dizzy

    dizzy New Member

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    The idea of the recall was to prevent any potential problems from happening. The symptom I saw was poor running, I suppose it could manifest itself in a charging problem. One thing you may want to check in regards to this is the blue multi pin connector in the boot behind the left rear part of the front cowl. There are other threads regarding this recall, do a search for more details.

    If you bring your 17 digit VIN to a Honda dealer, they can run it through IN and determine what has been done under warranty. If you don't trust your local...PM me your VIN and I can do it for you. Might be a few days before I get back to you...I'm outta town for the holiday!!

    I agree with others that it sounds like you have a bad battery. I disagree with auto replacing a battery after two years. I've seen 'em last ten years or better. Then again I've seen a well maintained battery go bad after a year. Seems like it's 'luck of the draw' sometimes. If you've got a good strong one, I say keep it.
     
  7. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    Started it today and realized I left out a point. After the motor cranks a few times and it stops cranking, it stops very abruptly with a clunk. Doesn't sound very good. But I can get it cranking again pretty readily.

    I had my battery tested at OReilly's today and they said it tested fine.

    I'm beginning to suspect an engine problem (valvetrain, etc.). Too soon?
     
  8. squirrelman

    squirrelman Member

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    Batterys can test fine for voltage and still fail a "load test."

    If you hear the starter whinning and lights gradually fade, you have a bad starter clutch.

    Seems like you may need to clean the contacts on the starter button also.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2009
  9. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    What role does the starter clutch play?

    By the way, I can't say that I can ever hear the starter whining in a "something's whirring but not contacting anything" sort of way. It's more of an electricity powering something sort of noise... I'm sure this makes no sense.
     
  10. squirrelman

    squirrelman Member

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    STARTER clutch plays the role of hero when it works properly, tranferring power through gears from starter motor to crankshaft....but plays evil villan when it fails.
     
  11. Meatloaf

    Meatloaf New Member

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    You've presented the common signs of a dying/dead battery. Go buy a new one and it should take care of all your problems. A good battery should give you well over 20 seconds of cranking.

    Here is a simple test. Try to start your bike... when it fails and does its clicking and wont crank... put a voltmeter on the battery. If you have 12V or above then it is fine. If you are below 12V, your battery is dying/dead.
     
  12. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    Definitely don't doubt that the battery could have an issue and be getting old. But would a bad battery cause this thud when the engine suddenly stops cranking that has a very metallic sound to it?
     
  13. Meatloaf

    Meatloaf New Member

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    I wouuld think so... if there is any resemblence to the starting system on vehicles or my mower. If my battery is dead on those, it will make a metal sounding clunk as it tries to start but doesn't have enough power. The moment it has enough power to turn over, the clunking will stop and the engine will start. I cant remember what causes the clunking on those but I think it is the starter relay solenoid. I'm pretty sure that is quite similar to the starter relay switch that is on our bikes if not the same thing.
     
  14. TOE CUTTER

    TOE CUTTER Mullet Man

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    Seven of the posts in this thread advised to replace the battery. It may not be the cause of your issue but it is such a common problem that it must be replaced to move on . I have seen members hoo and haa for weeks over a battery, why is this? I have seen major failures resolved quicker than a battery purchased.

    It drives me nuts!
     
  15. chomper

    chomper New Member

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    check for loose wire at starter they do come loose. and will cause symptoms you motioned i check mine now every time i change oil.
     
  16. dizzy

    dizzy New Member

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    I've heard a weak or discharged battery make all manner 'o weird phenomena...whines, flashing dash lights, clicking, clunking from the starter clutch. Battery tests can be deceptive, and of course everyone wants an immediate answer. But really, the best test is to fully charge it, let it sit for several days...THEN test it.

    You gotta pass or flunk it before you spend alot a time worrying about starter clutches and solenoids.
     
  17. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    No doubt you guys are smarter than me and, I'm sure, the battery will be replaced. I'm just trying to make sure I'm looking in the right spot and passing along pertinent information that would aid in the discussion (I'm an analytical guy). For instance the subsequent post that says to check the starter connection is valuable information.

    The heavy metallic clunk low and forward on the bike has made it hard to get my mind around it being related to the battery. That's all.

    But I really appreciate the advice that you all have given.
     
  18. jb9573

    jb9573 New Member

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    Found 2 plugs were fouled last weekend - engine fired up great today

    So I started my bike today just fine after changing my thermostat last weekend (it was stuck open) as well as the plugs thinking they might be fouled. And, oh were they. Both right side plugs were nasty and had caused the motor to start running extremely rough to the point the motor would hardly pull and wouldn't rev above 10K RPMs the day before I did the work. It was running so poorly I thought I was having a major mechanical problem.

    So I think I may have found my problem (bad plugs instead of a bad battery or starter clutch). Too soon to tell for sure, but the motor would have balked at starting after sitting up a week without use.
     
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