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  1. #1
    Member red0513's Avatar
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    Balancing a Tire

    I have searched the forms and the net and I see that every one and thing talks about balancing your tire. This said, I go to my stealership yesterday, (which second location is shutting down because of shitty service) to pick up my tires. They had beat the internet price that I gave them. I ask about getting them mounted and balanced and they said it would be 104 for both and that they could not balance the read tire. He then said that he could line up the dots and that 99% percent of the time this was fine. My question is, is this really ok? I would think this would kill the life and feel of the tire, but when asked he assured me it was fine and that they do it all the time. Any insight would be great and I will supply beer if your ever in the area


  2. #2
    Uber Guru bitterpil's Avatar
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    An out of balance tire will do what you think. The dots he is referring to mark what is called runout and it is matched with the heavy part of the wheel typically the valve. Issue is that sometimes that is not the exact point of the heavy part of the wheel. For instance, the heavy part of my wheel is about 2" from the valve.

    In doing my research I have read many things from many people. Some people never balance. Not a good practice IMO. Some tire brands need more balancing than others. Best thing is to balance the tires. I think your safety and well being are worth it.

    I mount and balance my own. You can get a balance stand from Harbor freight and they have a VFR adapter for about $65. You buy a pack of stickon weights from Motorcycle superstore for $12 (enough weights for several tire changes). Balancing your tires on a stand can give you better results than a spin balance machine. Mostly, because you are taking your time and be more exacting.

    I have posted this information on VFRW before but here. Watch these. They will give you some insight.

    YouTube - SCUDMAN How to remove a motorcycle tire
    YouTube - SCUDMAN How to install a motorcycle tire
    YouTube - SCUDMAN Balancing
    YouTube - Balancing a motorcycle tire
    YouTube - Mounting a Motorcycle Tire

    YouTube - Change a motorcycle tyre by hand.
    Use Windex instead of furniture polish to lube the tire.

    Good luck. I hope you get the info you are looking for.

  3. #3
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    I have done both. I can't really tell the difference but that doesn't necessarily mean there isn't one. I use the marc parnes wheel balancer and I think I paid around $115 for it with a VFr rear wheel adapter...

    Here is a how-to here on vfrworld:
    http://vfrworld.com/forums/brake-tir...balancing.html

    here is the link to marc parnes site: http://www.marcparnes.com/Honda_Moto...lancer.htm#HOV
    Last edited by reg71; 12-20-2009 at 11:25 AM.

  4. #4
    Senior Member monk69's Avatar
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    What ever tools you get, is going to save you money(usually 2 set's ; To 4 sets), with the cost of having it done for you. Not only money, but who's going to take the time to double check the work and to be careful enough not to scratch(reason for non scratch tools$$$)the wheel. These are close to the cheapest.... But will take some more money to mod to not scratch, I have the balancer here, but am thinking of going with the No-MarŪ set.

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  5. #5
    Member red0513's Avatar
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    Thanks for all of the help guys. Since I live in an apartment and don't have a garage to keep tools in I am out of luck for doing it myself. Lucky for me I found a person who I ride with who used to race and mounts his own tires. He has the tools and is going to help me out. Thanks for all of the replies and sorry it took me so long to get back I had some family issues come up.

  6. #6
    Uber Guru bitterpil's Avatar
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    Glad it is working out for you.

  7. #7
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    we mount and balance our own as well.. we have a NO MAR tire changer and balancer set..
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    Senior Member punisher12b's Avatar
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    ALSO PJ1 made a liquid balancer.. that i used.. no weights.. and it works WELL...
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  9. #9
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    I'm runnin Dyna Beads in both my tires. Seems to work great and supposedly you can recover them and re-use them in your next set also. Just my two cents.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member volks6000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by monk69 View Post
    What ever tools you get, is going to save you money(usually 2 set's ; To 4 sets), with the cost of having it done for you. Not only money, but who's going to take the time to double check the work and to be careful enough not to scratch(reason for non scratch tools$$$)the wheel. These are close to the cheapest.... But will take some more money to mod to not scratch, I have the balancer here, but am thinking of going with the No-MarŪ set.

    Scratch Proof MOTORCYCLE TIRE CHANGER machines, supplies and accessories.

    - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

    - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

    - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

    - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices
    that's the way I went (Harbor freight) saved a butt load of money, plus you know it's done Right.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metallican525 View Post
    I'm runnin Dyna Beads in both my tires. Seems to work great and supposedly you can recover them and re-use them in your next set also. Just my two cents.
    I use Dyna Beads on both the CBR and the VFR. No issues here.
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  12. #12
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    I have balanced tires by putting the axel bolt through the rim and resting the bolt on two saw horses sitting close together. I'm sure this is not the most accurate but way better than no balance at all! You can also check how true the rim is this way.
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    Both wheels should be balanced...this is the common wisdom. That being said, it is FAR more crucial on the front the the rear. You likely won't notice an out of balance rear, that's not to say it wouldn't adversely effect tire wear. If the the front is out of balance, it's evidenced by a wheel bounce usually within a certain speed range...very irritating.

    When I do wheels, I like to mark the heavy spot on the rim to match the mark on the tire (if it has one, sometimes they don't), not because it's an adequate balance job, but because it saves on weights (less unsprung weight always a plus). Sometimes Honda does this at the factory in the form of a painted yellow dot (more weights = more cost).

    I use a K&L wheelstand with knife edge bearings to balance wheels and I think it does an excellent job...better than a spin balancer. This is also how I've observed the factory tire pros balance at professional races. I don't care for the dyna beads and I know of at least one individual who claims they made his bike handle like 'pooh' until they were removed. And the liquid balancers?...all I can say is 'yuck'!!

    That your dealer can't balance a rear VFR wheel does not bode well. It's just assumed tires are balanced with a professional job...period. There's a whole array of VFR wheel adapters that work with any tire balancing method...or they could have one made. I use a round bearing driver with a hole in the middle that's actually BRP special tool.

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    Just found your link for the balancer and ordered it. Thanks for the info. I used to live in Santa Maria, now I live in Ok, I would love to ride my vfr out 166 to 33 and back up the coast. Anyway thanks again.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcompton View Post
    Just found your link for the balancer and ordered it. Thanks for the info. I used to live in Santa Maria, now I live in Ok, I would love to ride my vfr out 166 to 33 and back up the coast. Anyway thanks again.
    Well come on out next year for R3-2012 and you can ride some of those roads. There will be riders from Nevada and Arizona thatbyou can join in with for the ride I'm sure.

  16. #16
    Uber Guru Keager's Avatar
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    If your stealership can't balance, is there another shop around that can? I know of a couple around my neck of the woods that do. But, that is a long way from SC.
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  17. #17
    Junior Member treasurediver's Avatar
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    Static and Dynamic Balacing?

    I'm new here and have read as much as I can about mounting my own tires and it seems doable for my intermediate mechanical skills. The question I have about balancing is how do you do the Dynamic portion of a wheel balance? All I see here is the Static balance or do motorcycle wheels even need a Dynamic balance.

    Tire balance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Thank you all for your insight to tires and balancing. I am ready to buy my first set and I'm going with the Michelin PR2's.

    JohnB

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    Uber Guru donald branscom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by treasurediver View Post
    I'm new here and have read as much as I can about mounting my own tires and it seems doable for my intermediate mechanical skills. The question I have about balancing is how do you do the Dynamic portion of a wheel balance? All I see here is the Static balance or do motorcycle wheels even need a Dynamic balance. Tire balance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Thank you all for your insight to tires and balancing. I am ready to buy my first set and I'm going with the Michelin PR2's. JohnB
    You don't balance tires. You balance wheels. A wheel includes the tire. The tire WAS the problem. Some tires were 5lbs. heavier on one side. They make them better now. I have been working on motorcycles since I was 16. I am 62 now and still ride. I started out working in a motorcycle shop. A Honda dealership. Motorcycle wheels were never balanced. Some racers would statically balance them by putting them in a truing stand and putting solder or lead weight on them until the wheel could stop at any position and not turn. Very few people did that. Then the tire manufacturers came out with the dots painted on the tires. Next came the cast aluminum wheels. Wheel weights were stuck on and came off all the time. They tried to statically balance those but many times the stick on wheel weights would come off. Motorcycles got a lot of vibration going on up and down compared to a car wheel. That is why the weights would fly off.Matter of fact some riders said when the weights came off it ran smoother. BTW those static bubble balancers were known to give uneven results. The bubble balancer was not sitting on a level floor. The car people had a machine that could dynamically balance the wheel, but it had to fit in their machine so you had to have the adapter pieces for each brand of wheel. Usually only high end racing shops had those and it had a metal cage around it and it was very scary to see that operation. The other problem with that is they did not have the adapters for motorcycle wheels unless they were custom made. If you did dynamically balance the wheel you had to decide at WHICH SPEED you wanted it to be balanced. Just like a motorcycle engine , motorcycle wheels are not balanced at every speed. A calculation, (calculus) is made as to the cruising speed/RPM and the balance is calculated for that rpm and cruising speed. I have never seen a dynamic motorcycle balancing machine. There is a law of physics that says an unbalanced wheel will accelerate faster than a balanced wheel. Some of the new chopper wheels have balancing beads inside of a plastic tube wrapped around the steel wheel. I would have no worries about being on a motorcycle that has unbalnced (static), wheels.

    There are 3 kinds of wheel balancers.
    Bubble balancers are not anywhere near as accurate as either a spin or static balancer.
    A simple static/spin balancer (60-200)rpm costs about $2000.00
    Most motorcycle shops do not have that.
    But a true dynamic balancer that spins the wheel up to freeway speeds-never have seen one.
    I know of ONE car balancing dynamic balancer (full speed) because I saw it in operation in Santa Rosa Ca.

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    Uber Guru donald branscom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by treasurediver View Post
    I'm new here and have read as much as I can about mounting my own tires and it seems doable for my intermediate mechanical skills. The question I have about balancing is how do you do the Dynamic portion of a wheel balance? All I see here is the Static balance or do motorcycle wheels even need a Dynamic balance.

    Tire balance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Thank you all for your insight to tires and balancing. I am ready to buy my first set and I'm going with the Michelin PR2's.

    JohnB
    You don't.

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    Uber Guru donald branscom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadsmiley View Post
    I use Dyna Beads on both the CBR and the VFR. No issues here.
    Sounds like the way to go!

  23. #21
    Junior Member treasurediver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donald branscom View Post
    You don't.
    Hey DB, thank you greatly for the long and short answers. Much appreciated and it has helped me to decide to try this myself. Many have had success doing it themselves here and all have given more than enough information to DIY.

    Thank you again!
    JohnB

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    Uber Guru donald branscom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keager View Post
    If your stealership can't balance, is there another shop around that can? I know of a couple around my neck of the woods that do. But, that is a long way from SC.
    A spin /static balance machine for motorcycle wheels costs $2000.-$4000. I have not seen one in a motorcycle shop so far. Some car balancing machines CAN accomodate a motorcycle wheel if they have the right adapters.
    Most car shops probably don't want to mess with it.

    Just put your motorcycle tire on the wheel correctly, and don't worry about it.

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    Senior Member creaky's Avatar
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    There is a Snap On balancing tyre maching at a local shop that I use for my tyres. It spins them fairly fast, dont know about highway velocities though. I have statically balanced 30,000 dollar motorcycles wheels on a simple trueing stand

    I had a vibration on my VFR rear wheel a while back because I used some funky home made rod with cones mechined to the vfr rear wheel. I still use this on an old static trueing stand. What I ended up doing was re-balancing them on the expensive machine with the correct cones and Wah-Lah. No more vibrations at speed.

    What does this prove? Guess you gota have the correct cones if your gona balance your rear wheel if you have a Goldwing or a Viffer, or Ducati or MV Agusta or Triumph. Think the last three dont use specific cones for their wheels like Honda does. Cheers

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    Quote Originally Posted by reg71 View Post
    I have done both. I can't really tell the difference but that doesn't necessarily mean there isn't one. I use the marc parnes wheel balancer and I think I paid around $115 for it with a VFr rear wheel adapter...

    Here is a how-to here on vfrworld:
    http://vfrworld.com/forums/brake-tir...balancing.html

    here is the link to marc parnes site: Honda Motorcycle Wheel Balancer



    Thanks, I just ordered my VFR Drive Side Cone.

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    Thanks, I already have a stand. Just needed the adapter.

    As far as no-mar bars go, check Dave out @ No-scufftiretool good to work with. Event sent me prints and I made my own. Works perfectly. I love keeping $$$$$ in my pocket!

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    I have the Harbor Freight tire change stand and balance stand. I got my rear stand @ Fly-N-Cycle Motorsports - Sportbike & Motorcycle Parts and Sportbike & Motorcycle Gear, front came from MJ Moto Gear Stands, Tire Warmers, Other Track Gear,. Demount bar comes from No-scufftiretool. Attached are pics of modifications made to tire change stand. All works. Save over $100 every set!


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