Clutch Release Point 5th Gen

Discussion in 'Mechanics Garage' started by Big_Jim59, Apr 26, 2015.

  1. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    I was riding my VFR and my VTR one after the other. I noticed that the VFR clutch releases at the bottom, right off the stop, while the VTR clutch release almost at the top. They both use what amounts to identical clutch slave setups. Is there a way to adjust the clutch release point? I played with the adjustment on the lever with no appreciable difference.

    The VFR seems to have a lot of "nothing" through the start of the pull but it still goes into neutral while stopped so I don't think the clutch is dragging.
     
  2. Terry Smith

    Terry Smith Member

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    Hi Jim
    I've recently bought a VTR to keep my 5th gen company. I find the same thing, that the VTR lever is most of the way out when it engages compared to the VFR. I'd say it's just the way they're built because I know my clutches are well-bled and I also know you've been through your VTR from top to bottom.

    Just ride them and enjoy! The adjustment on the lever is just moving the lever relative to the master cylinder. I'd guess the "engagement point" has lots to do with the clutch springs and basket geometry so I doubt there's anything you could change.



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  3. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    Yep, the VTR is a different animal entirely. Very fun though. I don't think I would like to ride it long distance.
     
  4. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    get the cheap knockoff Chinese levers with the cam lever adjusters. The levers adjust how much reach on your fingers so it's not exactly the same thing.

    When's the last time replaced the clutch fluid and bled the system?

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Terry Smith

    Terry Smith Member

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    You got that right. The rawness of the VTR is a great contrast to the sophistication of the VFR. Both of mine are red and my wife thinks they're the same.


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  6. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    On both the VTR and the VFR the answer is never but I have been meaning to. Nice levers. They look complicated.

    It is Funny that Cadbure64 has the same clutch set up and feel on his VFR and VTR as I do on mine. Quite franking I am through with bike work for a few weeks. We are getting some good days in between storms so it's time to ride. I really need to change out the thermostat in the VFR. Was was dreading it but I'll bet it's child's play compared to pulling the engine in the VTR.

    We are getting some good riding days. I know you guys in CA are having a hard time with drought. We were really dry here all of last year but in April the rain came in waves. Now the lakes are back to full. It is pretty amazing.
     
  7. Terry Smith

    Terry Smith Member

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    I've got some very similar levers; great for adjusting the lever position to suit your hand size, but they don't change the clutch engagement point.

    I did the thermostat on my VFR last year and it's a pain to get to but not really any different to pulling the carbs on the VTR. You'll be fine. Just watch for any hoses that are past their best. I got lucky but I've read posts where the hoses refused to seal afterwards.


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  8. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    I just ordered a set of cheap knockoff Chinese levers with the cam lever adjusters for my VTR. ($24 and change on ebay but they might take a month to get here from China) I have already replaced the VFR levers after last years tip over. If I like 'em I'll get a set for the Y2K.
     
  9. OZ VFR

    OZ VFR Member

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    That's funny, my 01 is the other way around.
    It releases at the start of the stroke.
    I always wanted to bring it in a bit closer to the bars.
    But I'm used to it and don't really think about it while riding.
     
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  10. adeyren

    adeyren New Member

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    I had the same problem. Removed the clutch and very lightly sanded the discs, turned the rod around and hey presto, perfect clutch.I also have the chinese levers in red and theyre great.
     
  11. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    It is really time to do the thermostat. I was riding last Sunday the the outside temps were in the 80s. The bike heated up to 220, where the cooling fan usually kicks in but the temperature never dropped much even when running at road speeds. I think it is sticking but not opening all the way. I will find out soon enough.

    It's funny but I remember buying the parts to do the thermostat months ago but that was two major bike projects ago and I lost track of them. I turned the shop upside down trying to find them but to no avail. Last night I told my wife and she asked me what they looked like. I told her they were in a brown paper sack and she said "Oh. . .that was sitting on the counter in the kitchen and I got sick of looking at it so I put it in a cupboard. " She walked right up and pulled them out. Now I have all the parts and no excuses. I also ordered the short hoses. I figured if I am in there I might as well replace them too.

    I am a master at pulling the carbs on a VTR. I can do it in my sleep. I have done it so often I look like one of those NASCAR pit crew guys when I rip into them.
     
  12. Terry Smith

    Terry Smith Member

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    I've read your posts on the VTR forum so I'm sure what you say is absolutely true!!! I've learnt a lot from you.

    The only "special tool" I needed for the VFR was an extra long philips head screwdriver which you need to get to the insulator clamps that hold the throttle bodies to the head.

    The t/stat on my VFR was stuck open so it was slow to warm and probably ran a little cooler than it should have.
    IMG_0857.jpg
    IMG_1351.jpg
     
  13. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    You could have the clutch bled in 10 minutes Jim. And that includes time to drink a beer.
     
  14. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    What pretty girls sitting side by side! They do kind of look the same and are so different.

    I am not so cocky now. I got out in the shop, swapped the VFR places with the VTR (put it in the work area) and pulled the VFR tank. Then I stopped having no experience in these treacherous waters. I decided to get a roll of masking tape to label hoses and wires. I know it's over kill but it has save my butt in the past. It has a K&N filter so I will do the PMs while I am in there. From what I have read, getting all the wires hooked back up in the proper place seems to be one of the biggest issues with the job.
     
  15. Terry Smith

    Terry Smith Member

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    I had the same experience the first time I pulled the airbox off the VTR...its kind of the same but different!

    You'll be best off removing the tank; once the back bolt is out you can flip it over on its back (pad the subframe rails with something soft) then you can pull off the fuel line banjo. The tank is quite leak proof if kept upside down.

    Once you've got the airbox lid and filter out you'll be able to access the 4 vacuum hoses, two either side of the airbox. They're for starter valve synch and just park on stubs on the airbox, but are connected to the intakes below the TBs. There's a manifold air pressure sensor at the back (hose and cable) and an inlet air temp sensor cable below the airbox. To the bottom right is the vacuum solenoid for the flapper valve, this one is a PITA to reconnect. Then you've got a front and rear cambox breather, and the lucky last (right up the front) is the PAIR takeoff.

    You can happily blank off the PAIR system and remove the extra hoses, you'll need blanking plates for the camboxes as well. I'd definitely do that if you've got this far in, IMO makes no discernible difference to operation but gets rid of some clutter.

    I did not remove the throttle cables and was able to lift the TB assembly off the motor and swing it forwards out of the way to get to the thermostat.

    All of which seems pretty similar to getting the VTR apart; you should be able to do it in your sleep! Nothing on the VFR is quite as hard as getting those two *&%$#@!! hoses back on the front bottom of the airbox of the VTR!
     
  16. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    LOL, I am actually getting better at it. It would help if I had the hand of a child but there is a technique that requires everything to be aligned with only a minimum of slight of hand. You are right though, it is an absolute bear!
     
  17. Big_Jim59

    Big_Jim59 Member

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    I ordered the cheap knockoff Chinese levers with the cam lever adjusters. They look just like this. They don't fit. I am going to buy a Bridgeport mill so I can fix them right.
     
  18. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    First I've heard of anyone having a problem. Assuming something hasn't been overlooked, I'd say that's a good reason to get a knee mill.

    You might see if there's a local maker space where you can use machinery for a small membership fee.
     
  19. BMD

    BMD New Member

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    My 04 VFR, with 13 k miles has a clutch that engages really late. It feels too late. Is it normal or does it need a "fix"?

    Thanks
     
  20. mhzpower

    mhzpower New Member

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    I can confirm on my 01 vfr that I have a clutch point close to the grip. I'm waiting rebuild the master with new seals.

    I have a Bennett clutch kit so I'm wondering if it is the stiffness of the springs.

    In the future I might try the plate sanding mentioned, but it would be new territory for me.

    I have the adjustable levers and they help because they give me more stroke.

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