'86 VF500 won't start

Discussion in '1st & 2nd Generation 1983-1989' started by Mikey30006, May 18, 2015.

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  1. Mikey30006

    Mikey30006 New Member

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    Hi,
    This is my first post on this forum (or any motorcycle forum for at matter) so please forgive me if this question has been put in the wrong place.

    My dad just paid $700 for a 1986 VF500 because the guy couldn't get it to run in the driveway when I went to see him.

    I haven't actually gotten it back to my dad's shop yet to do any work on it (will begin on wednesday) but I was hoping someone could help me troubleshoot.



    Here's what happens: Key in, ignition on, kill switch on, push start button, engine turns over but won't catch.

    My first guess was going to be drain the gas tank and put fresh gas in, then check for a spark. I know the bike has been sitting for about a year.


    Is there a standard order of operations to get these bikes running again if those don't work? Also is there an easy way to get a torque wrench in to tighten the spark plugs properly?

    Thanks in advance!
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2015
  2. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    When was it last run? How old is the fuel? this will tell us if carbs need stripping before going any further, then you start looking through the ignition
     
  3. a2lute

    a2lute New Member

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    You can use gasoline in a windex bottle to see if it will run, I like that better than ether because ether/starting fluid breaks down your oil film. If it runs on the gasoline spray but not your carbs, your fuel delivery has issues. If it doesn't at least fire on gasoline spray it is probably an ignition problem. Pull a plug and make sure it's not fouled, once you ascertain it is clean with good gap you can hold it against your head (with a non-conductive screwdriver) where you can see the tip and crank the bike, look for spark. I think that's a decent start.

    -Arrmon
     
  4. Mikey30006

    Mikey30006 New Member

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    NormK: Unfortunately I don't know for a fact when the bike last ran, all I have is what the guy told me who sold it to me. He said that it had been sitting for about two years but started regularly with the last time being a few weeks ago. I would be willing to bet based on his apparent lack of knowledge of what a spark plug was that the fuel was quite old and likely had no stabilizer in it.

    a2lute: Forgive my lack of knowledge but where exactly do I spray this gasoline?

    Thank you both for your prompt replies! I will have the bike in my Dad's shop by tomorrow evening and will try the above!

    The only bikes I've ever worked on before are old harleys and their configurations allow pretty easy access to the engine. On my dad's old shovelhead you can actually remove the heads without having to take anything else off the bike so I'm not really used to working in such tight spaces. Is there a good way to get at the spark plugs with a torque wrench to reinstall them?

    Thanks
     
  5. desktopdave

    desktopdave New Member

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    I'd just tighten the plugs by feel. If you have a really nice torque wrench, use an extension and universal joint & go for it. I'm sure you know that a cheap torque wrench can be way out of calibration, and it's easy enough to strip out the plug threads.

    I think it's your carbs. But that's the last thing I'd check. I don't have a troubleshoting guide, but off the top of my head here are some ideas:

    Definitely test the plugs for spark...the spark boxes can be troublesome on these bikes and refuse to fire the coils. They tend to develop cold solder joints on the coil driver transistors; it's pretty easy to touch them up with a soldering iron though. Also test the fuel pump & fuel cut relay to be sure the bike is filling the carbs. If all that checks out...I'd be tempted to clean up the ignition switch, the kill switch, and check the main 30A fuse and starter relay wiring connector as they tend to melt. Also check the fuse box for melting. Also check the R/R connector. They tend to melt & short out too.

    I'd strongly suspect your carbs are plugged up. Please don't spray carb cleaner into them. The rubber CV diaphragms don't react well to that kind of treatment (it's the same basic Keihin CV carb as the smaller Harleys, just a little skinner).

    I don't spray gas or starting fluid down the carb throats...I pull the fuel tank & use a little fuel tank I scavenged from a snow blower to run the carbs directly.

    I know that sounds like a lot, but they're great little bikes once you get them sorted out. Early V4 carb overhauls are without a doubt the most difficult job I've ever done on a bike. The idle jets are tiny (like 0.3mm) and clog up with varnish in less than a year. Squirrelman should be along presently, he's the board expert on carbs. If the carbs are plugged up and you've never done a set of them, I'd strongly consider sending them off for cleaning.

    The V4s are infamous for being difficult to work on. At least the VF500 has an open frame! The V45/V65 Magna/Sabre have frame rails right over the motor...they are not fun to work on.
     
  6. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    Pull the tank,pull the top off the air cleaner, short squirt of starter fluid on the filter, hit the starter, and see if it attempts to fire, if so this points to the carbs being a big problem and will need cleaning, if it doesn't attempt to fire have to start looking at spark
     
  7. TOE CUTTER

    TOE CUTTER Mullet Man

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    I am wondering if the previous owner had the tank off and did not hook the petcock vacuum line up. It sounds like he expected it to run as you stated he could not get it to run in the driveway and that one is really easy to screw up if you are not familiar with it. Just a thought.
     
  8. Mikey30006

    Mikey30006 New Member

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    Thank you all for your input. I'll be sure to try all of your advice and I've also been in touch with squirrelman, he was very nice. I'd be very surprised if the current owner knew how to remove gas tanks.. but nonetheless I will check to see if the vacuum line is attached because you're right, he did seem sure it was going to run when I arrived.

    I'll have it up on the lift table by tomorrow night and I'll start tinkering! I'll keep you all posted!
     
  9. a2lute

    a2lute New Member

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    Mikey,

    I would spray the gasoline into the air filter box. You can access it as NormK described above.
     
  10. desktopdave

    desktopdave New Member

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    Good luck, let us know how it's coming along.

    One thing I forgot to mention about spare parts availability...I've heard that the '86 Interceptor 500 was significantly updated by Honda, right before they cancelled it. So it's kind of a unique model, somewhat different from the earlier '84-'85 VF500 'ceptor.
     
  11. Terry Smith

    Terry Smith Member

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    I tried this an ended up with a shocking headache!!
     
  12. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    Somewhere around the temple area seems to get a good result
     
  13. Mikey30006

    Mikey30006 New Member

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    Ok Guys,

    Sorry for the late response but work kind of got in the way of my tinkering this week. I went out to the shop today though and went at it.

    although the tank was indeed completely empty, new gas didn't help any.

    Pulled a spark plug, holy crap they are no fun to get at but I managed to get the one out on the rear left cylinder. It was filthy and looked like it had never been changed. Nonetheless there was a spark when I turned the bike over, albeit a weak one.

    I actually had to remove the gas tank to get a socket wrench in to the spark plug well and while I had it off anyway I tried quickstart in the air filter. Great success there, engine caught right away and ran for 6 or 7 glorious seconds. Bike sounds great, no top end noise or drama of any kind.

    My plans for monday night (which will be my next chance to go work on it) are to replace all 4 spark plugs with new ones, make sure I'm getting a spark in all 4 cylinders. Rig up an auxiliary gas tank to see if it'll keep running after the quickstart is spent. Beyond that I begin troubleshooting the fuel delivery.. I hear lots of carb talk, however the manual says I should be looking at the fuel pump first.

    What's my best bet? Carbs?

    Thanks again guys, you're all awesome!

    Mike
     
  14. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    Ok so stage one complete, motor runs, so ignition and wiring are ok. Next step is try a fuel bottle straight into the carb feed hose. Disconnect the fuel pump if it has one and see if it will now start, this will tell you if the carbs are going to work or not, if not you will have to pull the carbs and clean them before going any further
     
  15. Mikey30006

    Mikey30006 New Member

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    Do you mean to tell me that not all of the 86 vf500s had fuel pumps? Because I haven't actually seen one yet, just took the CLYMER 500cc V-fours 1984-1986 manual's word for it that there was one and I should run many tests I don't understand on it.

    Also, forgive my lack of experience but the carb feed hose is where exactly... is that one hose that feeds all 4 carbs? Like the line coming out of the gas tank if there isn't a fuel pump (or if there is, the line coming out of the fuel pump)?
     
  16. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    Sorry I have no idea, some VF's had pumps I think, some don't, some can run without a pump no idea what you have but the hose to feed the fuel bottle to is the one you describe, feeding the 4 carbs
     
  17. Mikey30006

    Mikey30006 New Member

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    After some more research it looks like there are in-fact no fuel pumps in 86 interceptors! One less thing to worry about I guess! Thanks for the tip NormK I would've driven myself nuts looking for one and being worried when there wasn't one!

    So straight up auxillary fuel tank into the line which leaves the stock tank I guess? I'll give it a go on monday and see what happens. I would be surprised if it starts up to be honest, I noticed the fuel line was quite wet when I took the gas tank off the bike today but a guy can dream can't he?

    Anyway, thanks again NormK!
     
  18. desktopdave

    desktopdave New Member

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    Yep, pull the main tank and pop an aux tank into the fuel line. I usually bend a coat hangar or some wire and hang it off the left handlebar/clip-on. The big tank just gets in the way.

    The inner & outer fuel valve seals can dry out and leak too, keep an eye out for that. Sometimes they come back to life, but I usually replace them just to be on the safe side.

    You can use SAE fuel hose in a pinch - 3/16" IIRC. I think 8x13mm pre-formed lines were OEM Honda. I'd recommend new fuel injection hose clamps too. I'd eventually replace the fuel line in that bike, it's not too long. There is probably a fuel line between the carbs too, but I'd leave all that for later.

    Here's hoping it's just a fuel issue. I still think those carbs need to come off.
     
  19. lampman

    lampman New Member

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    It really sounds like the carbs need cleaned. My 85 gunked up in a matter of a couple of weeks of no running. Bikes don't like to just sit.
     
  20. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    particularly with ethanol in it
     
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