Just Recieved Quote for 16K Svc !!

2010 V12F is at 16K miles (just had drive shaft recall done) and was quoted $1100 for the 16K service by a good shop here in San Antonio.
Holy sheep dip !!
I have experience checking/adjusting valve trains on other bikes (Kawasaki C10, Kawasaki Versys and 1980 CBX) but I admit the V12 intimidates me.
The thing runs like a champ and has been as reliable as a hammer.
I'm thinking of just replacing the air filter, having Guhl re-flash the ECU and calling it a day.
I'm aware of the age-old battle between the "I've got 100k miles on the motor and the valve cover has never been off" and the "follow the manual to the letter, these guys designed the damn thing" crowds, so I'm not looking to start that up.
Any one quoted similar rates for this service ?
Hell, I'm gonna be 65 this summer and the bike/motor will almost certainly out last me.
Comments ?
Advice ?

 

Holly shit! Another here older than me. I can't say I know much about the 7th gens. Hell. I've owned my 6th gen since new in 2006. The service schedule for the 16 k mark on the 6th gen is the same. The common concensus here is that the valve adjustments at 16k is money not well spent.

 

I've gotten the same feeling looking at 3 V12 forums.
I could tackle it myself but screw it, the damn thing never really gets run hard enough to hammer the valve train and I use Stabil marine grade stabilizer in it.
That's why you always want to buy a used big bore performance bike from an old guy.

 

My 07 800 had two valve checks (20,000 and 38,000). At 43,000 miles its never needed a adjustment.

 

See, that's what I'm talking about.
When was the last time anyone heard of a Japanese motor going south because of valve train failure ?
Exactly !

 

Does the shop provide one quote, and whether or not the valves need adjustment they charge the full rate? Do they treat valve adjustments like other jobs where the one difficult job balances the time against ten other easy jobs? Or do they charge less if the inspection reveals that all valves clearances are within specifications?

 

Well, you got me there.
I didn't ask (and should have), but the service advisor said it was 9 HOURS labor charge. Maybe that's worst case scenario and they have to change out shims in front and rear bank intakes. I think the $1100 includes new plugs (though the manual says inspection not replacement).
I did get them to drop the price to $900 if I bring it to them sans Tupperware.
I gotta pull the plastic off to change the air filter and pull the ECU anyway, so I'll just see how I feel when I get there.
I have the Honda workshop manual in my iPad but the pics are dark. Popping for a paper version would probably be a smart move (I rarely get accused of that).
Anyone out there with quotes from other shops for the 16k service ?

 

I would bet you my bike your valves don't need adjustment. Save your money.

 

I would get quotes from other dealers, including ones from adjacent states.

You'll find these quotes will vary significantly from dealer to dealer. $1,100 is extremely excessive, like almost double the cost.

I got a quote for my '02 VFR800 (VTEC) at it was $250 CANADIAN DOLLARS from one of the best Honda dealers in the province.

 

I suspect you're probably correct.

 

9 hours? Are they going over the entire bike front to rear and detailing it for you?

Look in your service manual and see what is supposed to be done at that mileage. I bet most of it is simple quick checks. Valves could take a long time, but I bet they only need checked, not adjusted.

Plus, two hours to remove the side fairings? Really?

 

There are a few videos on YouTube on how to do this, one was condensed down to 20 minutes but it takes well more than that just to get at everything! Although it is probably not a very difficult task i.e. Valve inspection/replacement, just difficult to get to everything. From just looking at the 20 minute video, it looks like a lot of remove/replace, measure, and repeat. There is also a special bit that you have to do for the V-Tec valves, which is probably the other more time consuming bit.

Long story short (I know, too late) unless you feel the valves are causing you trouble, might be a case of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Then again, there always..."An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" :wink:

 

I included the valve check on the list of things to do at 17K miles. All fluids, tires, plugs, brake pads... It was an independent shop and I had a surprise when I had to buy back my motorcycle. Primary valves checked fine and he said the process is normal. Secondary valves required a lot of labor, pulling shafts, borrowing roller pins to make check... and they were fine also.
Conclusion: Only check the primary valves. The secondary valves aren't called into service nearly as much, so save some money and wait until next time ;-)

 

UOTE=Jeff_Barrett;510490]
I got a quote for my '02 VFR800 (VTEC) at it was $250 CANADIAN DOLLARS from one of the best Honda dealers in the province.[/QUOTE]

They were quoting you for just checking the non vtec valves for that much

Checking the vtec valves includes cam removal and putting the locking pins into the sliding pin holder and re-installing the cams just to check the vtec valves and then taking it all apart again to do the bucket swap putting it all back together to check and then disassembling to remove the locking pins then final reassembly I have heard of quotes of $1600 for a full Vtec valve check

The 8 V-tec shims are also part of the bucket so the whole assembly needs swapping for new buckets NOT cheap and very rarely held in stock by dealers OR Honda

http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detail/honda/HP-14909-MCW-000.html

Hell most dealers don't even have a set of the sliding pin locks

And for the record I did my valves at 52,000 km's and found 3 vtec and 3 non vtec valves that needed adjustment I was lucky enough to be able to swap 1 x vtec bucket and just had to buy 2 and I already have a shim kit for the normal valves

It took me just over 10 hours at home in the garage spread over 2 days as I had to order the lifter buckets and I had never done one of these before but have done plenty of inline 4's and a couple of V twins before

The lifter buckets cost me $52 AUS $$ each

Not a fun job on the vtec 800

 

I remember seeing a very nice pictorial step by step of checking and (if needed) adjusting the valves on the VFR12 on one of the VFR forums but don't remember which one and can't seem to find it. Anyone out there give me a clue ?

 

Possibly you seek this post by Hispanic Slammer, the VFRD admin. He not only provides a great forum but also creates great tutorials for his VFRs:

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/68807-vfr1200f-valve-inspection/

 

Awesome.
Thanks for the link.
I'm not overly concerned currently about the valve clearances but am really stoked about having Don Guhl flash the ECU.
A riding buddy just clued me in to a Honda shop a little ways north of here with a quote of $650 for the 16k service, which is a bit more reasonable. I'll see how I feel when I actually behold what things look like under the tank.

 

Oh hell, I remember The first time I beheld what's under the tank of a Kawasaki C10 and thought , Holy shit !!
After I dove in, it seemed do-able and after a few years, it was deemed fairly simple.
Perhaps the VFR 12 is the same.
What a great piece of engineering though.
Trust me, as someone who began an infatuation with motorcycles in the mid 1960s, what we are riding now are a revelation.
It's only a machine. And the damn thing seems to be indestructible.
Air filter and Guhl re- flash may be the extent of the service.

 

No. I know exactly what I heard AND clarified.

I specifically asked for VTEC valve adjustment on my VFR800 and I even asked a second time to make sure I heard correctly. I was then told that it's not really that much more difficult than normal valve-train if you have the correct tools.

I know the Service Manager personally (old childhood hockey coach) and even though he throws me a bone from time to time, he typically doesn't do me favours in that department since there's labour involved.

 

Well how about 73 and still hitting the back roads hard on my VFR (a little less aggressive every year though).

Concerning the valve maintenance at 16K I would not do it at home unless he has the tools, Honda manual, and the necessary mechanical skills. Because of the uni cam design the cams have to come out to change shims on the intake valves if any are out of adjustment, not to mention removing the fairing, air box, pair valve plumbing, draining & removing the radiator (to get good access to the front cylinders exhaust valves) and re-installing the cams so they are timed correctly. Part of the problem with the high price Honda dealers want to do this work is the lack of experience working on the VFR 1200 as well as the considerable time it takes even for experienced mechanis. There are two Honda dealers in my area and they have sold four VFR 1200's total. I know the dealer service managers at both dealerships and until the driveshaft recall neither dealer has done anything except change tires & oil on these 4 bikes.

It would surprise me if any of his valves are out of spec at 16,000 miles. I have serviced modern Japanese bikes that had never had the valves touched at over 50,000 miles that were still in spec. Of course there is always the odd one that may need adjustment sooner.

One of the few advantages of being old is having seen the substantial improvement in both quality and lower maintenance these newer bikes require in comparison to what we rode even 20 years ago much less the first bike I owned 51 years ago in 1965 (a Triumph t-120 Bonneville). The downside is that it now takes more skill, time and special tools to do anything beyond basic maintenance.