Oil - Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle Formulation

I had a brain lapse and picked up Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle Formulated Full Synthetic 5W-30 oil (instead of Rotella T Full Syn 5W-40) and put it in my VFR last night along with a new filter. After buttoning it all back up (reinstallation of the fairing, clean up, etc.) I realized that I had purchased and installed the wrong oil. Duh! I can't believe I did that. I have been using Rotella T Full Syn for the last 20K miles and love it but now I don't know what to do. Ride it or change it out right away? Any thoughts on this? Does the New Vehicle Formula include "stuff" that is bad for clutches, etc? Is the formula ok for a shared gearbox? Where is Mike (Oil Guy) when you really need him? :)

Vic


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Vic

Ok, so I don't really have the answer but IIRC it has to do with the
Energy Conserving stamp on the conventional car/light truck motor oils.
Seems there are additives that mess with the wet clutch? Does the Super
Tech have that stamp?

I kinda did the same thing. I was running the full Syn Rotella T but
accidentally picked up the non-Syn Rot T and used it all last year
before noticing (close to 8k mi). Oh well, If it hasn't exploded yet...
Im going to use what I have left and switch back when I need more.

YMMV
Bryan

vic5491@xxxxxx wrote:
> I had a brain lapse and picked up Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle
> Formulated Full Synthetic 5W-30 oil (instead of Rotella T Full Syn
> 5W-40) and put it in my VFR last night along with a new filter. After
> buttoning it all back up (reinstallation of the fairing, clean up,
> etc.) I realized that I had purchased and installed the wrong oil.
> Duh! I can't believe I did that. I have been using Rotella T Full
> Syn for the last 20K miles and love it but now I don't know what to
> do. Ride it or change it out right away? Any thoughts on this? Does
> the New Vehicle Formula include "stuff" that is bad for clutches,
> etc? Is the formula ok for a shared gearbox? Where is Mike (Oil Guy)
> when you really need him? :)
--
One great wife (Life is good)
96'VFR750 (Life is better)
68/69 Dodge Charger (Have to have goals)
86'VF500 (Live long and prosper)
Lyme Vol. Fire
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vic5491@xxxxxx wrote:

> I had a brain lapse and picked up Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle
> Formulated Full Synthetic 5W-30 oil (instead of Rotella T Full Syn
> 5W-40) and put it in my VFR last night along with a new filter. After
> buttoning it all back up (reinstallation of the fairing, clean up,
> etc.) I realized that I had purchased and installed the wrong oil.
> Duh! I can't believe I did that. I have been using Rotella T Full
> Syn for the last 20K miles and love it but now I don't know what to
> do. Ride it or change it out right away? Any thoughts on this? Does
> the New Vehicle Formula include "stuff" that is bad for clutches,
> etc? Is the formula ok for a shared gearbox? Where is Mike (Oil Guy)
> when you really need him? :)
>
> Vic
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

I would drain it into a clean pan and save it for use in the cage or a
lawnmower or something.

The energy conserving oil has friction modifiers that have been known to
cause premature slipping on wet clutches. Also, the oil is just too
thin for this application, IMO. Honda recommends (their) 10W40 or
equivalent. API class SF or SG viscosity 10W40.

It's the second number that matters the most as that is the viscosity at
operating temperature. You really want an xxW40 in a high temperature
motorcycle engine.

You could save the cost of the filter by removing it, dumping what you
can and then reinstalling it. What small amount of oil remains will not
thin the new oil significantly.

YOMV

--

-Fred W

'98 Honda VFR800Fi
'05 Yammi FJR1300
'00 Aprilia Pegaso

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Bryan, the Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle Formulation does have the Energy Conserving designation. I think the additive pack that makes the oil slicker, thus making it energy conserving, is also what causes problems with wet clutches. Fred Wills mentioned this also and, in addition, questioned if the upper limit of a 5W-30 oil was sufficient when Honda recommends using a 10W-40 weight oil.

In the course of trying to figure out what all the designations mean and what is relevant, I found the following table explaining all the API designations. http://new.api.org/certifications/en...lGuide2006.pdf
While Honda recommends an SF or SG rated oil, as you can see these designations are deemed obsolete now BUT API says that when dealing with Gasoline Engine ratings (they all start with "S") it is safe to assume that newer designations like the current SM provide all the protection of lower / earlier designations and then some. This is not necessarily true (although usually is) with Diesel Oils whose API rating begins with a "C".

As I looked into all of this I began to recall that Mike (Oil Guy) recommended the Rotella T product due to it not having the energy conserving additives and that its additive pack was designed to reduce viscosity loss due to shear. (Our shared engine & gearbox oil suffers similarly to what diesels put oil through in terms of shear.) If you look at the API chart you will see that a designation of CI-4 Plus provides this protection and the Shell Rotella T Full Syn 5W-40 is rated for CI-4 Plus. So, in short, it looks as if the oils we should use would be those designed for diesels with the CI-4 Plus designation and without the "Energy Conserving" label/properties.

Thanks all! Back to Shell Rotella T Full Syn for me! I will be changing my oil again tonight.

Vic



Bryan Roth wrote:
Vic

Ok, so I don't really have the answer but IIRC it has to do with the
Energy Conserving stamp on the conventional car/light truck motor oils.
Seems there are additives that mess with the wet clutch? Does the Super
Tech have that stamp?

I kinda did the same thing. I was running the full Syn Rotella T but
accidentally picked up the non-Syn Rot T and used it all last year
before noticing (close to 8k mi). Oh well, If it hasn't exploded yet...
Im going to use what I have left and switch back when I need more.

YMMV
Bryan

vic5491@xxxxxx wrote:
> I had a brain lapse and picked up Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle
> Formulated Full Synthetic 5W-30 oil (instead of Rotella T Full Syn
> 5W-40) and put it in my VFR last night along with a new filter. After
> buttoning it all back up (reinstallation of the fairing, clean up,
> etc.) I realized that I had purchased and installed the wrong oil.
> Duh! I can't believe I did that. I have been using Rotella T Full
> Syn for the last 20K miles and love it but now I don't know what to
> do. Ride it or change it out right away? Any thoughts on this? Does
> the New Vehicle Formula include "stuff" that is bad for clutches,
> etc? Is the formula ok for a shared gearbox? Where is Mike (Oil Guy)
> when you really need him? :)
--
One great wife (Life is good)
96'VFR750 (Life is better)
68/69 Dodge Charger (Have to have goals)
86'VF500 (Live long and prosper)
Lyme Vol. Fire



---------------------------------
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Vic is correct. Diesels syns are the best and are formulated the same as much more expensive motorcycle oils. I buy rotella t at wal-mart for $15 a gallon. The energy saving oils have molly in then. Nfg for bikes



Mike Sowers
949-274-2045
IPhone generated message


On Apr 28, 2008, at 9:58 AM, "vic5491@xxxxxx" wrote:

Bryan, the Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle Formulation does have the Energy Conserving designation. I think the additive pack that makes the oil slicker, thus making it energy conserving, is also what causes problems with wet clutches. Fred Wills mentioned this also and, in addition, questioned if the upper limit of a 5W-30 oil was sufficient when Honda recommends using a 10W-40 weight oil.

In the course of trying to figure out what all the designations mean and what is relevant, I found the following table explaining all the API designations. http://new.api.org/certifications/en...lGuide2006.pdf
While Honda recommends an SF or SG rated oil, as you can see these designations are deemed obsolete now BUT API says that when dealing with Gasoline Engine ratings (they all start with "S") it is safe to assume that newer designations like the current SM provide all the protection of lower / earlier designations and then some. This is not necessarily true (although usually is) with Diesel Oils whose API rating begins with a "C".

As I looked into all of this I began to recall that Mike (Oil Guy) recommended the Rotella T product due to it not having the energy conserving additives and that its additive pack was designed to reduce viscosity loss due to shear. (Our shared engine & gearbox oil suffers similarly to what diesels put oil through in terms of shear.) If you look at the API chart you will see that a designation of CI-4 Plus provides this protection and the Shell Rotella T Full Syn 5W-40 is rated for CI-4 Plus. So, in short, it looks as if the oils we should use would be those designed for diesels with the CI-4 Plus designation and without the "Energy Conserving" label/properties.

Thanks all! Back to Shell Rotella T Full Syn for me! I will be changing my oil again tonight.

Vic



Bryan Roth wrote:
Vic

Ok, so I don't really have the answer but IIRC it has to do with the
Energy Conserving stamp on the conventional car/light truck motor oils.
Seems there are additives that mess with the wet clutch? Does the Super
Tech have that stamp?

I kinda did the same thing. I was running the full Syn Rotella T but
accidentally picked up the non-Syn Rot T and used it all last year
before noticing (close to 8k mi). Oh well, If it hasn't exploded yet...
Im going to use what I have left and switch back when I need more.

YMMV
Bryan

vic5491@xxxxxx wrote:
> I had a brain lapse and picked up Super Tech 5W-30 New Vehicle
> Formulated Full Synthetic 5W-30 oil (instead of Rotella T Full Syn
> 5W-40) and put it in my VFR last night along with a new filter. After
> buttoning it all back up (reinstallation of the fairing, clean up,
> etc.) I realized that I had purchased and installed the wrong oil.
> Duh! I can't believe I did that. I have been using Rotella T Full
> Syn for the last 20K miles and love it but now I don't know what to
> do. Ride it or change it out right away? Any thoughts on this? Does
> the New Vehicle Formula include "stuff" that is bad for clutches,
> etc? Is the formula ok for a shared gearbox? Where is Mike (Oil Guy)
> when you really need him? :)
--
One great wife (Life is good)
96'VFR750 (Life is better)
68/69 Dodge Charger (Have to have goals)
86'VF500 (Live long and prosper)
Lyme Vol. Fire


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