Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF

Hmmmmm....you're probably right, Chris. Prior to the ATF, I was using 120 gear oil. I only noticed a slight improvement over the gear oil. Maybe I should go back to gear oil, since my front end is so "ill". Plus, I can put a hole in the fork, and run a tube to the chain. Then, whenever I hit a bump, I can lube the chain. Who needs vacuum pulses?

I guess, more than friction enhancers, what's important in terms of friction is the final friction coefficient of either fluid, not so much how that came to be. I don't know the friction coefficient of fork oil vs. synthetic ATF, or for that matter, a whole lot about it in general. I just know that it seems to work fine.....

Dan B
-----Original Message-----
>From: Chris Burgess
>Sent: Jan 19, 2006 11:57 AM
>To: bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net, vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
>Subject: RE: Front Fork Seals / bushings - what to order?
>
>The reason not to use ATF is that all ATF has friction enhancers added to
>them to help enhance friction. This is a bad thing in forks as the last
>thing you want is extra friction in your forks not coming from the
>compression and rebound valving.
>
>Fork oil does not have these friction enhancers so your forks are going to
>perform to the specs to how they are setup.
>
>I suspect the reason most of you don't notice a difference is that you have
>such ill setup forks in the first place that 120w gear oil wouldn't be
>noticed.
>
>-Chris
>
>________________________________
>
>From: vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu on behalf of bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net
>Sent: Thu 1/19/2006 7:51 AM
>To: vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
>Subject: RE: Front Fork Seals / bushings - what to order?
>
>
>
>You can use ATF, my Hawk GT had it from the factory. I put one drop of brake
>fluid in the fork on my KX125 and it stopped the leak.
>
>--94' VFR
>Thanks,
>Bob
>_______________________________________________
>Vfr mailing list
>Vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
>For subscription and delivery options:
>https://lists.cs.wisc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vfr
>
>

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Geee....so fragile. :)

-Chris

________________________________

From: Dan Barufaldi [mailto:dbarufaldi (AT) earthlink (DOT) net]
Sent: Thu 1/19/2006 9:42 AM
To: Chris Burgess; bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net; vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
Subject: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF




Hmmmmm....you're probably right, Chris. Prior to the ATF, I was using 120
gear oil. I only noticed a slight improvement over the gear oil. Maybe I
should go back to gear oil, since my front end is so "ill". Plus, I can put
a hole in the fork, and run a tube to the chain. Then, whenever I hit a
bump, I can lube the chain. Who needs vacuum pulses?

I guess, more than friction enhancers, what's important in terms of friction
is the final friction coefficient of either fluid, not so much how that came
to be. I don't know the friction coefficient of fork oil vs. synthetic ATF,
or for that matter, a whole lot about it in general. I just know that it
seems to work fine.....

Dan B
-----Original Message-----
>From: Chris Burgess
>Sent: Jan 19, 2006 11:57 AM
>To: bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net, vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
>Subject: RE: Front Fork Seals / bushings - what to order?
>
>The reason not to use ATF is that all ATF has friction enhancers added to
>them to help enhance friction. This is a bad thing in forks as the last
>thing you want is extra friction in your forks not coming from the
>compression and rebound valving.
>
>Fork oil does not have these friction enhancers so your forks are going to
>perform to the specs to how they are setup.
>
>I suspect the reason most of you don't notice a difference is that you have
>such ill setup forks in the first place that 120w gear oil wouldn't be
>noticed.
>
>-Chris
>
>________________________________
>
>From: vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu on behalf of bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net
>Sent: Thu 1/19/2006 7:51 AM
>To: vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
>Subject: RE: Front Fork Seals / bushings - what to order?
>
>
>
>You can use ATF, my Hawk GT had it from the factory. I put one drop of
brake
>fluid in the fork on my KX125 and it stopped the leak.
>
>--94' VFR
>Thanks,
>Bob
>_______________________________________________
>Vfr mailing list
>Vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
>For subscription and delivery options:
>https://lists.cs.wisc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vfr
>
>




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Yo, I wish I had da ill setup forks, fo shizzle! My
homie had the Ohlins... they was da sickness, yo!

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ill

Warren

--- Chris Burgess wrote:

> Geee....so fragile. :)
>
> -Chris
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: Dan Barufaldi
> [mailto:dbarufaldi (AT) earthlink (DOT) net]
> Sent: Thu 1/19/2006 9:42 AM
> To: Chris Burgess; bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net;
> vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
> Subject: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF
>
>
>
>
> Hmmmmm....you're probably right, Chris. Prior to
> the ATF, I was using 120
> gear oil. I only noticed a slight improvement over
> the gear oil. Maybe I
> should go back to gear oil, since my front end is so
> "ill". Plus, I can put
> a hole in the fork, and run a tube to the chain.
> Then, whenever I hit a
> bump, I can lube the chain. Who needs vacuum
> pulses?
>
> I guess, more than friction enhancers, what's
> important in terms of friction
> is the final friction coefficient of either fluid,
> not so much how that came
> to be. I don't know the friction coefficient of
> fork oil vs. synthetic ATF,
> or for that matter, a whole lot about it in general.
> I just know that it
> seems to work fine.....
>
> Dan B
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Chris Burgess
> >Sent: Jan 19, 2006 11:57 AM
> >To: bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net, vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
> >Subject: RE: Front Fork Seals / bushings - what to
> order?
> >
> >The reason not to use ATF is that all ATF has
> friction enhancers added to
> >them to help enhance friction. This is a bad thing
> in forks as the last
> >thing you want is extra friction in your forks not
> coming from the
> >compression and rebound valving.
> >
> >Fork oil does not have these friction enhancers so
> your forks are going to
> >perform to the specs to how they are setup.
> >
> >I suspect the reason most of you don't notice a
> difference is that you have
> >such ill setup forks in the first place that 120w
> gear oil wouldn't be
> >noticed.
> >
> >-Chris
> >
> >________________________________
> >
> >From: vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu on behalf of
> bob.harmon (AT) comcast (DOT) net
> >Sent: Thu 1/19/2006 7:51 AM
> >To: vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
> >Subject: RE: Front Fork Seals / bushings - what to
> order?
> >
> >
> >
> >You can use ATF, my Hawk GT had it from the
> factory. I put one drop of
> brake
> >fluid in the fork on my KX125 and it stopped the
> leak.
> >
> >--94' VFR
> >Thanks,
> >Bob
> >_______________________________________________
> >Vfr mailing list
> >Vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
> >For subscription and delivery options:
> >https://lists.cs.wisc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vfr
> >
> >
>
>
>
> > _______________________________________________
> Vfr mailing list
> Vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
> For subscription and delivery options:
> https://lists.cs.wisc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vfr


Passion is the difference between living and existing
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>From: Dan Barufaldi
>I guess, more than friction enhancers, what's important in terms of
>friction is the final friction >coefficient of either fluid, not so much
>how that came to be. I don't know the friction coefficient >of fork oil
>vs. synthetic ATF, or for that matter, a whole lot about it in general. I
>just know that it >seems to work fine.....


I looked it up awhile ago and M-1 synthetic ATF has almost identical
viscosity to 10wt Golden Spectro fork oil.

I tried the M-1 synth ATF in my VFR's stock 41mm stock forks and it seemed
no different than any other fork oil I've used in the past.

Later...ROB
'99 GL800RR-SP2
Spouse's- '90VTR250
Profile Page: http://profiles.yahoo.com/veefer800canuck
Website: http://www.geocities.com/veefer800canuck/index.html


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Removed original fork oil...


Replaced with ATF...


Feels great...


No worries...

Bob in Tucson
Then:
90 VTR 250
98 VFR 800
03 CBR F4i

Now:
01 VFR 800
04 Chevy Avalanche
http://vifferman.tripod.com/vfr_album/

http://www.frappr.com/?a=myfrappr&id=72717

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For how often you replace fork oil, is buying a lubricant designed
for the job really that expensive? Yeah, ATF will work. But it
still isn't as good as something designed for the application from
the start. It is also available in different viscosities, unlike
ATF, so you can set up your forks properly. Not every fork set-up
calls for 7wt oil, which is about the viscosity of ATF.


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Mobil 1 Synth ATF is negligibly less expensive than fork oil? Why would you
assume this was based on cost? You simply cannot assert that it isn't as
good as something "designed" for the application. For some, it seems to
work better. The viscosity appears to be fine for my use. If I needed a
different viscosity, I would do what I did when I chose synth ATF. Research
what works.

And I think synth ATF be less temperature sensitive (viscosity) than
conventional fork oil, at my environmental temps (yes, if you had it in your
tranny, and overheated the car, it would be damaged....I'm talking about 80
degrees vs. 20 degrees, ambient temps that I encounter while riding). I
know the front suspension gets less "brick-like" in the cold than it used
to.

Dan B

-----Original Message-----
From: vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu [mailto:vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu] On Behalf Of
Michael T. Kasimirsky
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2006 10:56 AM
To: vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
Subject: Re: RE: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF

For how often you replace fork oil, is buying a lubricant designed
for the job really that expensive? Yeah, ATF will work. But it
still isn't as good as something designed for the application from
the start. It is also available in different viscosities, unlike
ATF, so you can set up your forks properly. Not every fork set-up
calls for 7wt oil, which is about the viscosity of ATF.


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> Mobil 1 Synth ATF is negligibly less expensive than fork oil?
> Why would you
> assume this was based on cost? You simply cannot assert that
> it isn't as
> good as something "designed" for the application. For some,
> it seems to
> work better. The viscosity appears to be fine for my use.
> If I needed a
> different viscosity, I would do what I did when I chose synth
> ATF. Research what works.

Actually, yes, I can assert that it isn't as good as something
that was designed for that application. To do otherwise would be
to ignore the whole industry that develops oil additives. I
guarantee they don't use the same additive package in ATF that
they use in fork oils. The applications are different and additves
are expensive so they don't add them unless they serve some practical
purpose. In the case of ATF, additives put in there for the health
of the transmission clutch packs serve no purpose in a motorcycle
fork.

> And I think synth ATF be less temperature sensitive (viscosity) than
> conventional fork oil, at my environmental temps (yes, if you
> had it in your
> tranny, and overheated the car, it would be damaged....I'm
> talking about 80
> degrees vs. 20 degrees, ambient temps that I encounter while
> riding). I
> know the front suspension gets less "brick-like" in the cold
> than it used to.

Temps of 80 versus 20 make no difference to oils, period.

And yes, I used to work in the oil industry so I can say that
with 100% confidence.

I could care less what you use, but this assertion that ATF is
somehow better than a product engineered for that application
is a stretch. It might have made sense when fork oil was hard
to find, but that isn't the case today.

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On Jan 22, 2006, at 09:28, Dan Barufaldi wrote:

> Mobil 1 Synth ATF is negligibly less expensive than fork oil? Why
> would you
> assume this was based on cost? You simply cannot assert that it
> isn't as
> good as something "designed" for the application.

Certainly you can. ATF is optimized for use in automatic
transmissions - hence the name. Motorcycle fork damping is a
different operating environment entirely - heat, pressure, shear,
etc. By definition, if something is optimized for one application it
CAN'T be optimized for a totally different one.

KeS
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>And yes, I used to work in the oil industry so I can say that
>with 100% confidence.
>
>I could care less what you use, but this assertion that ATF is
>somehow better than a product engineered for that application
>is a stretch.
>

This discussion has gotten out of hand. Someone recently remarked about
how the number of posts has fallen dramatically on this board in the
past couple of years? Perhaps discussions like this are part of the reason.

Here we have Dan, a long-time, respected list member saying he has used
Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF in his VFR forks and it works well. That's solid,
if anecdotal, evidence that the item in question works.
What he hasn't mentioned is that we've had this same discussion several
times in the past decade, and that there are a pretty fair number of
experienced VFR riders and list members who ALSO use this product, and
who ALSO are getting very good results from it. That raises it from
anecdotal evidence to proven results.

Then on the other side are a small cadre of folks I've never heard from
before who are claiming that the stuff can't be any good because we're
using it in an "off-prescription" manner or "unauthorized" application.
Significantly, NONE OF THEM CLAIM TO HAVE ACTUALLY TRIED IT THEMSELVES.
They just say it shouldn't work.

The list has shrunk over the past couple of years as more and more of
the experienced, knowledgeable members have decided they'd had enough of
putting up with newbies who know it all and can't be bothered to check
out the archives to see if the their questions have already been
answered. Veteran member Oil Guy got flamed unmercifully recently--and
the result is that the list lost the experience and knowledge of a
life-long professional petroleum engineer whom any other vehicle-related
list would give their eye-teeth to have on board. Also recently another
newbie, 'Chat-with-Johnny', performed a feat I've never seen happen on a
big list before: his inanity just about destroyed what was left of the
list, single-handedly.

I'm just about ready to call it quits with this list, myself. I've been
here for 8 years, and lately the signal-to-noise ratio has increased
just about to the breaking point.

Not that MY leaving would be a significant blow to the list--I never
claimed to be a super-mechanic. But I do have a news flash:
--the really knowledgeable guys...the ones that seem to be leaving in
larger and larger numbers...they can go off by themselves and do just
fine. They've got experience, knowledge, and common sense. They don't
NEED the list ; it's the list that needs them.

Gee, I haven't started a flame war in years. Maybe it would be best
after all if this list just 'went Nova'. It's been painful to watch it
just wither away for the last couple of years.

Regards,

BurmaWolf



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>From: Fred Hunter
>Then on the other side are a small cadre of folks I've never heard from
>before who are claiming that the stuff can't be any good because we're
>using it in an "off-prescription" manner or "unauthorized" application.
>Significantly, NONE OF THEM CLAIM TO HAVE ACTUALLY TRIED IT THEMSELVES.
>They just say it shouldn't work.

And don't ever modify your exhaust as it will "increase noise and decrease
performance" according to Honda. And only use the exact brand and size tires
specified in the owner's manual at only the recommended pressures, and for
GOD'S SAKE MAN, DON'T USE ANYTHING OTHER THAN PRO HONDA 10W40 OIL IN YOUR
VFR OR YOUR HARD DRIVE IN YOUR COMPUTER WILL EXPLODE.

Hey, I've ran the M1 synth ATF in my forks for the last couple of years.
Seals did not leak, the forks still forked, and it felt way better than the
old dirty fluid. I ain't Rossi or Mladin, so I couldn't tell you anything
other than that. It's equal to 10 Wt viscosity as per the data sheets from
Mobil's website.

Did I save money buying M-1 Synth ATF at Canadian Tire as opposed to going
to the shitty little local Mom 'n Pop ATV/lawnmower/snowblower shop (only
game in town, BTW) and getting Bel-Ray fork oil at 12.95/litre because
that's all they carry? Yes, I most certainly did.

Use whatever brand/type/weight fork fluid smells the best behind your ears
and go ride.

Later...ROB
'99 GL800RR-SP2
Spouse's- '90VTR250
Profile Page: http://profiles.yahoo.com/veefer800canuck
Website: http://www.geocities.com/veefer800canuck/index.html


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> >And yes, I used to work in the oil industry so I can say that
> >with 100% confidence.
> >
> >I could care less what you use, but this assertion that ATF is
> >somehow better than a product engineered for that application
> >is a stretch.
> >
>
> This discussion has gotten out of hand. Someone recently
> remarked about
> how the number of posts has fallen dramatically on this board in the
> past couple of years? Perhaps discussions like this are part
> of the reason.
>
> Here we have Dan, a long-time, respected list member saying
> he has used
> Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF in his VFR forks and it works well.

"Worked" and "better" are two different things.

Yes, it worked. I never said it didn't.

But saying it is "better" is a SERIOUS stretch of the imagination.

And frankly, I don't give a good dump about "long-time respected
members" of the list. Nothing personal against Dan, but incorrect
opinions, held for long periods of time, doesn't make them any
more correct.

> What he hasn't mentioned is that we've had this same
> discussion several
> times in the past decade, and that there are a pretty fair number of
> experienced VFR riders and list members who ALSO use this
> product, and
> who ALSO are getting very good results from it. That raises it from
> anecdotal evidence to proven results.

See above. "Working" and "better" are two radically different
things. In addition, comparing new ANYTHING to the old crap
in your forks is also a completely bogus comparison. New ANYTHING
is better than old oil. If you want a legitimate comparison, you
need to compare new ATF to new fork oil, not old crap to new ATF.

The whole arguement about the cost of fork oil is also a joke,
in my opinion. You change fork oil so infreqently that the
additional cost is immaterial. If you're that hard up for
money that fork oil costs are significant, that VFR had better
be your sole source of transportation because you can't afford
a recreational vehicle.

If you want to run ATF in your forks, knock yourself out. I'll
put Race Tech fork oil in mine, thanks.

Michael T. Kasimirsky
mtk21 (AT) adelphia (DOT) net
1996 VFR750F
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Perhaps I did not read this thread right. I am pretty sure all that was
said was that ATF worked fine for whoever posted. Did not read anywhwere
where anyone claimed it was "better", just that it worked fine for them.
Opinions are neither correct or incorrect, they are opinions, that is why we
have that specific word.

doug

-----Original Message-----
From: vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu [mailto:vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu] On Behalf Of
Michael T. Kasimirsky
Sent: January 22, 2006 6:35 PM
To: 'Fred Hunter'
Cc: vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
Subject: RE: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF

> >And yes, I used to work in the oil industry so I can say that with
> >100% confidence.
> >
> >I could care less what you use, but this assertion that ATF is
> >somehow better than a product engineered for that application is a
> >stretch.
> >
>
> This discussion has gotten out of hand. Someone recently remarked
> about how the number of posts has fallen dramatically on this board in
> the past couple of years? Perhaps discussions like this are part of
> the reason.
>
> Here we have Dan, a long-time, respected list member saying he has
> used Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF in his VFR forks and it works well.

"Worked" and "better" are two different things.

Yes, it worked. I never said it didn't.

But saying it is "better" is a SERIOUS stretch of the imagination.

And frankly, I don't give a good dump about "long-time respected members" of
the list. Nothing personal against Dan, but incorrect opinions, held for
long periods of time, doesn't make them any more correct.

> What he hasn't mentioned is that we've had this same discussion
> several times in the past decade, and that there are a pretty fair
> number of experienced VFR riders and list members who ALSO use this
> product, and who ALSO are getting very good results from it. That
> raises it from anecdotal evidence to proven results.

See above. "Working" and "better" are two radically different things. In
addition, comparing new ANYTHING to the old crap in your forks is also a
completely bogus comparison. New ANYTHING is better than old oil. If you
want a legitimate comparison, you need to compare new ATF to new fork oil,
not old crap to new ATF.

The whole arguement about the cost of fork oil is also a joke, in my
opinion. You change fork oil so infreqently that the additional cost is
immaterial. If you're that hard up for money that fork oil costs are
significant, that VFR had better be your sole source of transportation
because you can't afford a recreational vehicle.

If you want to run ATF in your forks, knock yourself out. I'll put Race
Tech fork oil in mine, thanks.

Michael T. Kasimirsky
mtk21 (AT) adelphia (DOT) net
1996 VFR750F
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>From: "Michael T. Kasimirsky"
>If you want to run ATF in your forks, knock yourself out. I'll put Race
>Tech fork oil in mine, thanks.



And I repeat:

"Use whatever brand/type/weight fork fluid smells the best behind your
ears and go ride."

Later...ROB
'99 GL800RR-SP2
Spouse's- '90VTR250
Profile Page: http://profiles.yahoo.com/veefer800canuck
Website: http://www.geocities.com/veefer800canuck/index.html


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Wow....so much wrong with what you're saying, it's not even worth arguing
about.

Have a nice day

-----Original Message-----
From: Michael T. Kasimirsky [mailto:mtk21 (AT) adelphia (DOT) net]
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2006 1:36 PM
To: dbarufaldi (AT) earthlink (DOT) net; vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
Subject: RE: RE: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF

> Mobil 1 Synth ATF is negligibly less expensive than fork oil?
> Why would you
> assume this was based on cost? You simply cannot assert that
> it isn't as
> good as something "designed" for the application. For some,
> it seems to
> work better. The viscosity appears to be fine for my use.
> If I needed a
> different viscosity, I would do what I did when I chose synth
> ATF. Research what works.

Actually, yes, I can assert that it isn't as good as something
that was designed for that application. To do otherwise would be
to ignore the whole industry that develops oil additives. I
guarantee they don't use the same additive package in ATF that
they use in fork oils. The applications are different and additves
are expensive so they don't add them unless they serve some practical
purpose. In the case of ATF, additives put in there for the health
of the transmission clutch packs serve no purpose in a motorcycle
fork.

> And I think synth ATF be less temperature sensitive (viscosity) than
> conventional fork oil, at my environmental temps (yes, if you
> had it in your
> tranny, and overheated the car, it would be damaged....I'm
> talking about 80
> degrees vs. 20 degrees, ambient temps that I encounter while
> riding). I
> know the front suspension gets less "brick-like" in the cold
> than it used to.

Temps of 80 versus 20 make no difference to oils, period.

And yes, I used to work in the oil industry so I can say that
with 100% confidence.

I could care less what you use, but this assertion that ATF is
somehow better than a product engineered for that application
is a stretch. It might have made sense when fork oil was hard
to find, but that isn't the case today.

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I don't see the problem here, I only use Wesson(tm) oil in my forks, it works great and I can deep fry potato strips in my forks just by driving on the BQE from Astoria to the Brooklyn Bridge.

I just have to be careful not to let any of the Wesson(tm) oil drip onto my tire plugs, or I have to use lemon Pledge(tm) to fix the mess.


-Brad


-----Original Message-----
From: vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu [mailto:vfr-bounces (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu]On Behalf
Of Dan Barufaldi
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2006 10:15 PM
To: mtk21 (AT) adelphia (DOT) net; vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
Subject: RE: RE: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF


Wow....so much wrong with what you're saying, it's not even worth arguing
about.

Have a nice day

-----Original Message-----
From: Michael T. Kasimirsky [mailto:mtk21 (AT) adelphia (DOT) net]
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2006 1:36 PM
To: dbarufaldi (AT) earthlink (DOT) net; vfr (AT) cs (DOT) wisc.edu
Subject: RE: RE: Fork Oil vs. Synth ATF

> Mobil 1 Synth ATF is negligibly less expensive than fork oil?
> Why would you
> assume this was based on cost? You simply cannot assert that
> it isn't as
> good as something "designed" for the application. For some,
> it seems to
> work better. The viscosity appears to be fine for my use.
> If I needed a
> different viscosity, I would do what I did when I chose synth
> ATF. Research what works.

Actually, yes, I can assert that it isn't as good as something
that was designed for that application. To do otherwise would be
to ignore the whole industry that develops oil additives. I
guarantee they don't use the same additive package in ATF that
they use in fork oils. The applications are different and additves
are expensive so they don't add them unless they serve some practical
purpose. In the case of ATF, additives put in there for the health
of the transmission clutch packs serve no purpose in a motorcycle
fork.

> And I think synth ATF be less temperature sensitive (viscosity) than
> conventional fork oil, at my environmental temps (yes, if you
> had it in your
> tranny, and overheated the car, it would be damaged....I'm
> talking about 80
> degrees vs. 20 degrees, ambient temps that I encounter while
> riding). I
> know the front suspension gets less "brick-like" in the cold
> than it used to.

Temps of 80 versus 20 make no difference to oils, period.

And yes, I used to work in the oil industry so I can say that
with 100% confidence.

I could care less what you use, but this assertion that ATF is
somehow better than a product engineered for that application
is a stretch. It might have made sense when fork oil was hard
to find, but that isn't the case today.

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I didn't realize you sent this to the entire list.

To paraphrase your response, in other words you don't have anything
to say other than to attempt to disparage the author, followed by
some bullshit "have a nice day" comment.

If you have a legitimate point, then make it. Otherwise, you can
stuff the "have a nice day" comment as the context in which it was
made was condescending.

> Wow....so much wrong with what you're saying, it's not even
> worth arguing
> about.
>
> Have a nice day
>
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Brad, you idiot !!!!

Don't you know that Honda recomendations clearly state that only extra extra virgin olive oil is to be used in forks ??

Blinker fluid replacement, on the other hand.........

Brad Berson wrote:

I don't see the problem here, I only use Wesson(tm) oil in my forks, it
works great and I can deep fry potato strips in my forks just by
driving on the BQE from Astoria to the Brooklyn Bridge.

I just have to be careful not to let any of the Wesson(tm) oil drip
onto my tire plugs, or I have to use lemon Pledge(tm) to fix the mess.


-Brad



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