Help...my VFR bled out on the side of the road.

Discussion in 'General VFR Discussions' started by VFRNut, Aug 12, 2017 at 5:49 AM.

  1. VFRNut

    VFRNut New Member

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    I was coming back from a long group ride along the Pacific Coast Highway. Right as we were about to make an exit to get gas, my riding buddy started pointing frantically at me to pull over. I was thinking "chill out man, I know we need gas, we are getting over right now"...then I looked down and noticed I was hemorrhaging oil. I pulled over and the bike dumped the remaining contents of its hot oil on the side of the road. My back tire was covered in it (thank goodness I didn't make the exit or do any turns) and it was all over my hard bags and even my friends bike. He said that he started smelling oil a mile back and there was a trail for about a mile. I never noticed the oil pressure light until it was too late. I finished the last 200 miles of my ride sitting in a tow truck (Progressive Roadside Assistance rocks!)

    I haven't pulled the fairings off yet to inspect the bike, but from a visual inspection with the fairings on, it looks like it was higher up on the engine so I don't think I am dealing with a simple oil filter or plug problem. I bought the bike used (it only has 30k miles on it) so I wasn't anticipating problems like this, but I guess my bad luck caught me again.

    Has anyone had this happen before?
    What is the best case scenario?
    What is the worst case scenario?
    Should I take it to the Honda Dealer and have them go through it?
    What might I be looking at cost wise for the repair?

    Any help you can offer is appreciated. I now have a beautiful bike sitting in my garage and it won't be used again until I can get it fixed and fixed right. I have to be able to trust it to take it on future long rides.
     

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  2. derstuka

    derstuka Lord of the Wankers Staff Member

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    I'm sorry to hear of your luck but glad to hear you're ok.

    We're you running a k&n oil filter by any chance? Several members had the same oil leaking failure you had and it turned out to be a failed oil filter. From the quantity of oil you described, it sounds like most likely would be the oil filter, oil cooler, or oil plug. Those are my guesses. Oil filter being my first guess, then oil drain plug.

    Where are you at currently in Cali? I'm near SF if you need help. Lots of members in SoCal as well. Let us know your status.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2017 at 6:06 AM
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  3. VFRNut

    VFRNut New Member

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    Yes, a K&N oil filter (new) was on the bike when I bought it. What is the deal, are these known to fail or something?
    I live in South Jordan, Utah. I was going eastbound on I-80 to get back home and broke down at the first Wells, Nevada exit. I am home now with my bike. That is really nice of you to offer to help though, thanks. I would be grateful if it was a simple oil filter and plug. Tell me more please about why you suspected the K&N oil filter.
     
  4. derstuka

    derstuka Lord of the Wankers Staff Member

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    Oh dear. K&N has a HORRIBLE history with oil filters failing around the "removal" nut on the end of it. Prolly has happened to a dozen people in here at least.

    Inspect the end of the filter around the removal nut and look for signs of a leak/crack. It might be subtle.
     
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  5. derstuka

    derstuka Lord of the Wankers Staff Member

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    If that is the case, consider yourself lucky and never put k&n oil filters on anything you own again. Use Honda, use puralator, whatever, just not k&n.

    There really needs to be a class action lawsuit against them. I am dead serious
     
  6. derstuka

    derstuka Lord of the Wankers Staff Member

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    From member Anne Marie in Canada last year. Luckily, she didn't go down.


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Point of failure for her k&n filter
    [​IMG]


    Am I crazy or did your first post say you were on the pacific coast highway (in California)?
     
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  7. thtanner

    thtanner Member

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    This is why everyone on these forum preaches to toss K&N in the trash. I've seen 5+ incidents last year ALONE!

    OEM, Bosch, Wix - all good choices.
     
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  8. VFRNut

    VFRNut New Member

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    Thanks for posting all that and the pictures. I have a better idea of what I am looking for. The carnage looks familiar. Assuming I caught it quickly, do you think I did any damage to my engine?

    I think my subject line may have misled you (though it was past tense) and I also used past tense in my post to recount an experience I had just recently been through. I am so glad that it didn't happen to me out in Stewart's Point and other areas where I was really far away and without any cell reception. Yes, I went through Santa Cruz, SF, Healdsburg. Very pretty ride. You guys are lucky to have that as your riding area.
     
  9. derstuka

    derstuka Lord of the Wankers Staff Member

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    Man, what a bummer....you rode right by me. Prolly by 1/2 mile. Did you stop at Alice's Restaurant in the mtns? Well, I'm glad you all had fun. NorCal (and Central Cal, and SoCal) has some outstanding riding for sure.

    If you shut it off right away, I really doubt any engine damage. I would take note of how much comes out. Either way, not much you can do now. Inspect it was the filter, drain and measure oil remaining, fill her up and just ride her like you stole her!
     
  10. thtanner

    thtanner Member

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    As said above, unless you ran it until the engine locked up, it's fine. Drain oil, swap filters (with OEM, Bosch 3300, or Wix) and go on your merry way.
     
  11. VFRNut

    VFRNut New Member

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    Alright, thanks guys. When I can get some time, I will open it up and see if it was the K&N oil filter and then report back with my findings. If true, I am not sure why people are buying these things and putting them on their bike, save for sheer ignorance of the facts. Maybe K&N should re-market them as oil pressure bombs for the the adrenaline junkies out there that need an added risk to the ride.
     
  12. derstuka

    derstuka Lord of the Wankers Staff Member

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    From my understanding, a member or two has contacted K&N regarding the issue, and as you would expect, they vehemently denied their filters had any problems. I think the only way things will change is from a class action lawsuit....and that is very unlikely to happen for only a small number of motorcyclists. If this was happening on tens of thousands of brand new Honda Civics from the factory, I would wager that they would be dancing to a different tune since Honda, many thousands of owners, as well as the media would be hammering them.

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Sniper

    Sniper Member

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    The black K&N that was cracked at the nut, failed because of improper installation.

    The nut is there for removal, not installation.
     
  14. thtanner

    thtanner Member

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    Why do people keep repeating this, when it's simply not true?

    There have been a number of failures where the nut was never touched.
     
  15. duccmann

    duccmann Insider

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    My understanding is that the nut leaks from using a socket for installation--- but the o-rings fail as well


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  16. Sniper

    Sniper Member

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    What ll said was absolutely true. I wil break it down for those with reading comprehension issues.

    The, meaning: One, Singular K&N, failed because of improper installation. The (one) filter in the picture, is the Only oil filter that l was talking about.


    I will add, since it was brought up, and some one was trying to put words into my mouth, Wether the gasket fails, or not, l can't/won't comment. However, if people are so inept as to wrench tighten an oil filter so tight that it tears the body of th oil filter, you would have to question wether or not those same people properly lubed the gasket, and properly hand tightened the filter.

    I have owned enough used motorcycles to know that the worst thing that happens to a new motorcycle, is the clods that own them.
     
  17. A.M

    A.M Moderator Staff Member

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    Do you think this truck I'm standing by is big enough to hold my enormous amount of ineptitude and clodiness? There should be room. I'm rather small and sounds like my intelligence is too.

    [​IMG]

    I'm guilty of going against my better judgment and doing what I was told.
    I should not have listened. At least I didn't choose to buy the darned thing.

    But I did pay the price nonetheless and could have majorly crashed and seriously injured myself with the speed I was going and the terrain I was in. Thankfully I'm not a clod when it comes to reacting in an emergency and I saved my engine and myself.

    But apparently I continue to crash and burn in these threads every time this topic is brought up.

    At least I lived, learned, and hope this will help others in the future.

    Thankfully you seem to have not made a mistake of this magnitude, as I wouldn't wish this on anyone (plus I think you are awesome and enjoy learning from you)...or not made any mistake of that matter when it comes to your motos unless you call yourself an inept clod too. But if you have, party in the truck bed for sure!! :)

    If not, I'd venture to guess you've done other doozies in your life that I haven't, so I'll definitely share the truck bed...

    I'm a super cuddler and fun drunk... because there will be drinks!!

    No matter the heat, I just hope it may help someone avoid a catastrophe like I experienced...or worse.

    To the OP, I'm sorry this happened to you and glad you weren't hurt. Hope you got cleaned up and sorted. Do you have the cause of the oil spill figured out yet?

    Whether or not the filter was the culprit, I hope you stay away from K&N on the VFR in the future.

    Another member here posted photos in another thread (possibly my Canada trip last year, I can't remember) showing the size of an OEM filter compared to the K&N and the they were not the same. Which I've read of the filters failing at the mating surface, not just at the spot weld nut...in my opinion a given weak point right from the start even without a good torquing from A.M.

    And if I remember right, another member recounted K&N oil filters failing without the nut being touched at installation.

    With all the reports plus many other filters available, why risk a filter that has had welding done to it?

    Best of luck and I hope your moto is okay.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2017 at 11:25 PM
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  18. thtanner

    thtanner Member

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    Let me repeat myself since you couldn't hear from up on your high horse.

    There have been a number of failures where the nut was not used on installation. Most to all of the failures look identical to the one pictured. End of story.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2017 at 3:58 AM
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  19. Ghost_Rider

    Ghost_Rider Member

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    I have to chime in after reading this response above.

    After reading AM's many adventures, as well as corresponding with her about my admiration of what she does, it is not hard to understand that she is a truly a remarkable person, and a very intelligent one at that. I have an enormous amount of respect for her and all that she does. Fast forward to your above comments and you are basically inferring that she is an inept clod. This in and of itself is reason enough uncover that you are a level 10 jackass of the 102nd battalion of the keyboard commandos.

    Do some searching on the internet, and you will find literally hundreds of fellow motorcycles from all walks of life, from all skill levels, from different countries, and they all have experienced K&N filters failing in some manner. Many never even touched the nut on the end. Even if they did use the nut, and they were cautious, why didn't K&N put BIG red warning letters on the end of the filter, on the box, as well as on their website, indicating that it is a matter of life and death of they use the nut on the end to put the filter on? You ever hear of R&D and reliability testing? You would have thunk that a company as big as K&N would have put the filter thru rigorous testing and discovered that use of the nut to tighten a filter was a very serious potential weak point that could lead to catastrophic failure of the oil filter and potential serious injury or death of the rider. Part of testing is to determine how a product many fail and pushing it until it does fail. I have never in my long life of dealing with car and motorcycle filters encountered one oil filter that failed, or a friend's that failed, until this K&N debacle. This clearly is a major flaw/oversight on K&N's part. Companies are notorious for not admitting potential flaws in the design of their product for fear of litigation. K&N doesn't even have the foresight to put warnings and instructions on how hazardous it is to use the nut for install. And again, as I mentioned before, many riders had failures without use of the nut at all.

    I guess you must have a hard-on for K&N for some reason, and you feel better about taking cheapshots at A.M and her intelligence. Isn't there a bridge that you need to troll under?
     
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  20. lone_wolf

    lone_wolf New Member

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    That was a low blow to am. I wish I had the courage that she has in her adventures, and I do mean ADVENTURES!

    I personally know two people that this failure happened to. Very lucky they did not crash and burn. I will never buy one of their filters again. Glad the OP is safe. Trash that POS and get a Honda filter. You can never go wrong with a Honda filter.
     
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