83 VF750F clutch issue

Discussion in '1st & 2nd Generation 1983-1989' started by sruss67, Apr 11, 2009.

  1. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Hi all and have started working on the new to me VF and discovered a well stuck set of pistons in rear brake caliper(sorted now), the clutch seems to be allowing the engine to turn when pulled in, I have bled the line and still no joy. Is the clutch shot?, I will be pulling down to check soon. The neutral light seems to come back on in 2nd gear also, goes off in all other gears except 2nd, could it be the neutral switch on the engine? Am looking at fitting Dunlop Arrowmax tyres soon as not a lot to choose from. Good or bad choice?.
    Thanks for any and all help.
    Cheers Shane.
     
  2. Trefmawr

    Trefmawr New Member

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    Dunno if this will help, but I have an 84 VF750F, and I've noticed that neutral actually feels like a gear on it's own, instead of a half pull up like every other bike I've ever ridden.

    Also, have you tried putting the bike in gear (1st if you can) and tried to roll it with the clutch pulled in?

    If the clutch were seized, I don't think you could pull the clutch lever at all, or it would have a lot of resistance.

    Hope this helps!
     
  3. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Thanks for the info, the clutch engages and all gears engage and what happens is when you put the bike into 1st you can feel it trying to pull whilst the clutch is engaged.
     
  4. cstmvfrguy

    cstmvfrguy New Member

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    do you have dot 4 fluid in the clutch. i used dot 3 once and it never felt right. could be something to check.
     
  5. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Yes, used Dot 4 and will dismantle soon to check plates and springs etc. Maybe I should pull down further before asking more questions?
     
  6. masonv45

    masonv45 New Member

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    Burp the banjo bolt on the M/C.
     
  7. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Thanks masonv45 and by "burping the banjo bolt" what exactly is it you mean. I read in the forum about ensuring the banjo fitting at the master cylinder needs to be at the lowest angle possible. Do you mean to crack it open at the banjo bolt to let air out? or tap whilst bleeding?
     
  8. masonv45

    masonv45 New Member

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    It means to crack the banjo bolt while engaging the clutch lever - just as you do with the bleeder valve. Air gets trapped in the banjo bolt/MC connection and is notoriously hard to remove.

    This can be a two man job (one man if you're dexterous) and be sure to cover painted areas with a rag.
     
  9. alex5160

    alex5160 New Member

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  10. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Thanks guys and I will crack open the banjo bolt fitting this weekend and let you know how I go masonv45. Lets see how dexterous I am. :)
     
  11. Ghost

    Ghost New Member

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    I absolutely love these bike’s clutch systems. FYI, your clutch should always be set so that when you pull in the lever, it engages early, and lets out early… I.e. as soon as you begin to let the lever back out, you should begin to feel the bike try to roll.

    Ok Chief, heres a hit list for you to check out. Starting with the simple easy stuff.

    Get a second opinion. (find someone who rides a lot, and let them take it for a “round the neighborhood” trip. )

    Adjust the thumb wheel at the lever, and move the lever out. (this gives you more stroke, and a longer reach to compress the springs in the clutch basket)

    Double check all your bolts. (ensure all the bolts in the Secondary cylinder are secure… don’t over tighten.)

    Bleed the system. (do not underestimate this; it take a long time to get that stubborn little stupid dam bubble out) ((This includes cracking some of the banjo bolts. At times, if a bike is left to sit for a long while, and it has an air bubble, it could rise to the top, and be in your banjo bolt at the master cylinder))

    Replace the fluids and bleed the system. (Dot 4 only.)

    Replace the seals in the Master cylinder piston. (old bike, sits a while, seals get a set in them, then you go and move the lever a few times, and ruin the seal. It happens)

    Replace the seals in the Secondary cylinder. (same as the Master cylinder, but doing this one sucks hairy ones, cause the inner seal and piston must be set perfectly, and then the outer seal must be set. ***WARNING*** the outer rubber is NOT, repeat NOT, a cover boot as you may think, it is an actual seal. When pulling this cylinder, ensure you keep it depressed in, and do not let the piston come out of the cylinder wall. You will curse yourself for hours if you do.)

    Check for excessive deflection / add support if necessary. (If you sit down at your bikes side, and repeatedly pull the lever, you should be able to watch to see if your Secondary cylinder flexes and deflects excessively. Some of the main sprocket guards are weak, or cracked, and provide no rigidity to which the cylinder will force against. If this is your problem, let me know I will show you how to properly re-support this area permanently.)

    Pull your clutch rod. (check the rod for damage or that its broken in two…hey it happens)

    Remove the right side engine cover, and inspect the clutch springs. (sometimes the springs can get broken, and broken springs like to nest within itself…which causes a high resistance force.

    Pull the clutch basket and check for wear. (get a micrometer, and measure the overall thickness of each clutch plate, and clutch slip plate. Cross with your bike repair guide and determine if you need to replace your clutch disks… **more common on bikes with 60K + miles on them**, then again, if the system wasn’t right from day one, you could ride the clutch so that it burns them down rather quickly too)

    At this point, if your clutch still isn’t functioning properly, your issue could be within your individual gear levers and the gear cam. (I recommend you take the bike to a professional for a good opinion, and run down inspection of your work, before you begin to open and work on the transmission assembly)

    Lastly, you noted your light comes on at odd times, sometimes. The connection point for these bikes at the right cover side, are kinda shitty. Pull the connector off, and clean it. Use a pair of needle nose pliers, if you need to, and compress the spade connector a little so that it creates a little more interference, then push it back on.
     
  12. Ghost

    Ghost New Member

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    Oh, I almost forgot, if you replace the seals in your secondary cylinder, do it, submerged in DOT 4 fluid. the fluid is clear, so you can see what you are doing...and this eliminates the variable that you will put more air in.
     
  13. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Hi Ghost and thats a wealth of information re my clutch issue. Thanks and will be looking at the clutch again tomorrow, so will let you know how it goes. You seem very knowledgeable with regards to this model. I take it previous learnings and dealings with the VF have helped. :)
     
  14. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Well I re-bled the clutch today and cracked open all banjo fittings along the line whilst bleeding. The clutch is still allowing the engine to pull whilst the clutch is engaged. So my job for Thursday is to drain the oil and check the clutch and the slave cylinder as well. Did re-kit the front brake calipers with new seals and new oil today and success there :) . Will check the neutral switch whilst the engine oil is drained as well.
    Having fun and told my fiance it's therapeutic, haha :)
     
  15. Ghost

    Ghost New Member

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    well, its good you take it as a puzzle, and not a defeat.

    I admit, I actually like working on my bike more than riding it...(sometimes)
     
  16. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Well the saga continues. Pulled out the clutch slave cylinder and looks like a small oil leak around the piston seal, so rang the local honda dealer again and couldn't believe they had piston and seals, spring etc in stock. Amazing how many bits are available for a bike this age. Have also sourced a used tacho as the needle was broken on the old unit (looks like a common problem) and the drive was faulty meaning the tacho was way off. Happily making progress and have had Bridgestone BT45 tyres fitted to the VF as well. One more full day of tinkering and hopefully ready for roadworthy check, then registration, THEN RIDE.
     
  17. GreyVF750F

    GreyVF750F Member

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    That little leak is not your problem. Your clutch is probably bad. Like in glazed, hard surface but not worn out. Just the material on the face of the clutch has seen better days after 24yrs. Also the steels will start to warp .005-.015. I replaced mine last year after 52k miles. I bought stock plates and frictions from one of the Honda OEM parts sites on the web. Most of after market makes noise or rattles (Barrnet). My clutch frictions were only .001-.0025 less thickness compared to the new ones. You could see how the oil was baked in to them. The steels were warped a tad also. There's a spring,looks like a big coned washer that you should replace also. It puts the pressure on the pack when engaged. It's cheap and a better do while your in there. New clutch makes a world of difference.
     
  18. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Yep you were correct on the clutch, need to order plates and frictions and price of AUS$370 + $87 for gasket set(bottom end complete), ouch. May look for cheaper alternative on the web. Anyone know of anyone sending to Australia. Clutch spring is $25.20. Best to use genuine parts I guess.
     
  19. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Well I finally pick up the clutch cover gasket from local honda shop today and then it's time for the barnett clutch to go in. Fingers crossed this is about it for repairs so I can register and ride. Am itching to get on a bike again.
     
  20. sruss67

    sruss67 New Member

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    Got the clutch in yesterday and all is well with that now. New problem is on the way home the right rear indicator stopped working, it cut the engine when it happened. Bike started again and now the right dash light and rear lense do not flash. Looked for the problem for 2 hours with no luck and then found on restarting that the starter solenoid seemed to fire up 2 cylinders only then the other 2 kicked in. I enjoy mechanical challenges and electrical ones do my head in aaaagggghhhhhhh. Anyone got any ideas?, are the two problems linked somehow. I rode the bike for 30km round trip before this happened and all seemed fine.
     
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