Riding with passenger?

I am a rider that has a couple years of riding experience under my belt. That being said I am sure I still have alot to learn.

My question stems from carrying a passenger. I ride 2up quite a bit. The problem I cant seem to overcome is stopping and maintaining balance. When I am solo I can pretty much come to a complete stop maybe 1MPH before I put my feet down for stability to hold the bike. With a passenger it seems like once the bike gets past being stable from a few MPH I cant seem to overcome the extra weight that throws the balance off. I usually end up walking the bike to a stop to keep it stable and once in awhile I have to almost catch the bike it seems from strange balance. Some times I actually have to use the front wheel at a goofy angle to keep the bike upright when going very slow coming to a stop.

When I come to a stop if I am in alot of slow traffic I typically just use the rear brake and if anymore power is needed I add the front. If I am riding more aggressive I use both brakes, I use the rear brake and I slowly add front once weight transfer is complete after initial grab at front and feed in front as needed. And pretty much use both up to the light or whatever I am stopping for. I also downshift through the gears and use some engine braking.

I kinda dealt with it somewhat on my DR650 but have since gotten over it. On the VFR it seems worse with a passenger.

Just all but feels like the weight transfer is pulling to the side with a passenger almost instead of straight forward.

Any tips on how to overcome this would be great. Maybe its just a mental block with me. But bike just seems so much more unstable with a passenger at low speeds and I have to catch it with my foot more it seems. Something I never do solo.

I am beginning to wonder if its somehow induced by my girlfriend on the back. Like she is shifting her weight around during a stop.

Thanks

 

Unless your girlfriend is an experienced rider herself, I doubt she knows to hold still and sit in the middle. I've had to teach a little "class" about sitting to all of my ex's Passengers like to look ahead and see what you are stopping for (and if you are going to hit it) - to do this they have to lean one way or the other to see past your head sometimes. Keep in mind that stability is 100% related to the center of gravity. 2 up riding will always be more unstable than solo because the CG is higher. Other thing you might consider is messing with the pre-load on the suspension. I'm not an expert on that, but found that my bike was MUCH more controllable running higher pre-load settings when heavily loaded. Good luck!

 

Since it seems to be okay when you're solo we'll assume the bike geometry is okay. It's possible that your girlfriend is feeling the bike lean a bit so she leans to counteract it, you also move to counteract the lean which makes it even worse. This could be exacerbated if she is a pretty good sized gal, maybe weighs a bit more than you. If you're short and have trouble flatfooting with both feet then you could be leaning the bike just like you were solo but with a rider on the back everything is exaggerated.

The main thing is talk to her, and any other passenger, and remind her/them to not lean separately and just keep centered.

Your braking maneuvers sound a bit backward to me. I use the front brake mainly, with a little back brake thrown in, but not much. When it comes to braking with a passenger smoooooooth is the key word.

 

+1 on the stop short. slow rollers SUCK.

 

I agree with FJ-- you're braking technique is a little skewed. Something like 80-90% of your stopping power happens in the front, so you need to use your front brakes in the same ratio. Many riders never use their rear brake as it can lock up the rear wheel if the tire is on loose gravel and cause fish-tailing.

Your balance problem sounds like an issue with your passenger. Ubermaxii and FJ both explained it well. If possible, add a sissybar or backrest for your passenger, then tell them to plant their back on it and not lean. I've been able to build a backrest that fits into the back of my corbin seat on my Gen 5. My wife loves it.

 

One thing I forgot to mention... if you use the phrase "don't lean" they may get the wrong idea and try and stay upright when you lean to turn (not THAT big of a deal, but definitely limits your maneuverability). Try and make her think of "becoming one" with you - she'll probably find it romantic. Last ditch effort, use a ratchet strap around your chest and her back

 

It works just as well the other way around too!!! :biggrin:

 

Having ridden for many years, with and without passenger, I can say that with the "wrong" person behind you, you can easily get off balance, with the right passenger it's almost like riding solo. This past R3 I rode up with the wife and I have to say I hardly noticed her on the back. With the exception of during the "quicker" stops where she would slide into the back of me and when it got really twisty. Two things helped this, one the GIVI top case with the back rest attachment and the passenger rider grips A.K.A. "love handles" (Go ahead Reg, insert comment here), both allow her to sit more inline with the bike and keep her sitting still a lot more that before, although she never was a bad passenger, these items give her a more secure feeling which helps keep her still. Once in a while she'll try and look over my shoulder to see why we've stopped and then I can feel a balance shift (typically middle of the highway stops, i.e. stop and go/heavy traffic, not so much at lights/stop signs). The key is to make sure the passenger is aware that any movement they make can upset your balance and possibly make you both topple over. I told my wife that looking over my should is only good when we are cornering (as in over the left when cornering left, over the right when cornering right) and that it makes it difficult for me to maintain my balance when she does it when were stopped. So far she has been really good at keeping still and following the "rules" but she'll usually let me know if/when she has to shift with a hand signal we came up with. It let's me get prepared for the weight shift.

Now that I have the VFR, the top case and the rider grips, the wife wants to do more and more bike road trips and I can say I don't mind doing them with her, it keeps us close and we both really enjoy it. Of course, if I want to go solo, I just say I'm taking the Ducati out and she automatically opts out. She's not comfortable on the Duc and I don't have any of the "extras" that she likes on it and don't plan to.

I hope this is helpful.

Cheers

 

rode a katana 1100 with a top case that used to get a wobble at 130 mph. That said, You should use your front brakes more aggressively with a pilllion and end the stop with your rear brakes. You could get away with just the front binders mind you, but the whole concept is to equalize the bikes arse end, so this way/your stops are like a magic carpet ride. Bike just settles to a stop, if your creeping, you may wana cover brake pedal/use it.

Rules change when you carry a pillion yah know, its kinda a pain in dah arse sometimes, ie - walking speeds, parking lots, u-turns, you get the idea...just take it slow. I tell the wife I gota get up to almost 90 mph before we shift into 6th gear. I am relegated to 75mph on our highways by order of the German-Kremlin

 

Thanks for all the help guys! I will see if shes not doing something funny while stopping. She weighs a little more than me so that doesnt help either. I usually use both brakes, just usually stick with back unless more is needed will try using the front more when two up.

 

Did you say what year your bike is? Keep in mind, the VFR has the linked braking system.

 

ridervfr made a good point about shifting when 2 up: don't shift as soon as you would solo. Leave the revs higher so that you don't lug the engine if you need to accelerate suddenly. I also try to make the ride even more smooth by really utilizing the slip-clutch. Anything to make your passenger more comfy is a win.

 

93 so I dont have the linked braking.

 

Love the shirts that say, "if you can read this, the bitch fell off!"

a gud yard-stick to judge how smooth you are is: do your helmets bang when your coming to a stop? do they bang when your accelerating?...I assume that we are tawking about full face skid lids here. I dont know about you, but I got a $600.00 Arai, and thats more than enough motivation not to have a bang session on my bike. In the bed-room, thats another story.

Dont even axe about those open face brain buckets, I guess someone could wear one if they had like a "butta-face"/ you know, everything is hot about her, cept her face....hence Butta-Face, not to be confused with someone you gota put a brown paper bag over. My bike usually shifts quiet kinda like Butta,,,:tongue:

 

I ride 2 up often with my wife & daughter, They complain about the passenger pegs being too high. I added "driver" peg lowering adapters and waiting for BSL or someone to make some for the passenger, at least 1 1/2" lower like the drivers. I also clicked the preload 2 notches stiffer, but I'm about 240 lbs. so it's staying that way, big difference in a good way! Also, I wear a belt when 2 up, to give them another option for something to hold on too.

 

A belt, good idea! My wife used to insist on holding on to my waist band of my leather jacket. If she wasnt my wife, I woulda put my foot down, I tell you!!!

All I ever do is add an extra 5 pounds of air to my rear tyre. 41 from the 36 pounds...I dont bother touching my Fox shocks pre-load...thats about it...I used to like riding passengers more before I got married btw....:evil: :smile:

 

LOL. Well you guys called it! She was looking around my shoulder and then everyone was over-correcting. Thanks guys now I can ride at like 2mph and bike is balanced fine!

 

Happens all the time, hence so many of us chimed in on that. Glad that sussed out, now go out have fun and ride safe!

Cheers

 

I heard about a guy with the same problem. It was rear tire pressure. His girlfriend weighed 450.