So.. VF500F info :)

After perusing the forums and based on the wonderful info I received from you guys so far, regarding my questions on the VF400... I shifted my focus towards the VF500F.
Plenty of info to be found, plenty of possible cool mods to bring the bike into 2014, and plenty of parts to be had cheaply make this a superior candidate project bike.

Still some questions though before I pull the trigger on a bike and open a project log..
Based on my previous experiences, I now want to research as much as possible before I buy, make up a budget and roadmap, and keep myself to that.
I will try to open-source my budget and wrenching experience as much as possible, as I did with my previous project.

I'm really fond of the VF500F in red/black/white:


From what I have learned so far: (the following in comparison with more modern bikes)
The engine is wonderful, and will last as long as you warm up the bike long enough before opening the throttle.
The frame is nice and stiff, and contributes to great handling.
Wheel sizes are very, very dated, and a CBR600F2 wheel swap will benefit handling and tyre choices. Brakes were OK, but it seems the F2 had bigger rotors, so I'm looking at a full front-end swap.
Suspension is subpar, rear shock needs to go, air-assisted forks are a no-go and I'd rather pass on the TRAC system.
Still need to dive into the electrics and ignition system. Any comments are more than welcome. I would foresee programmable ignition.

If I do this, it will be a resto-mod, which means I want to try and improve on an existing concept, and mesh 1980's tech with modern technology to bring a vintage bike into this century.
I could also wave a wad of cash at a dealer and buy a modern bike that handles better, accelerates faster, and stops quicker, but there lies an enormous satisfaction in "rolling your own" and knowing every bolt on a bike. Somewhere in my future lies a months-long trip trough Europe, and I would not want do that on a bike that I don't know inside and out.
I would probably end up trying to improve on that modern bike too, and that would end up very costly :tongue:

• Halfway 1985, Honda adjusted some stuff to change the engine characteristics, with a better focus on midrange. Does anybody know which frame codes or month I should look for? (I guess by then, the cam issues were solved too?)
• If I end up buying a VF500F2, are the VF500 bikini-fairing body panels a direct swap?
• Is the CBR600F4 shock a direct bolt-on swap or is a spring or damping adjustment needed?
• How much shorter are the CBR600F2 forks compared to the stock VF forks? I can't seem to find hard info on that one. Can I swap the whole frontend or am I better off tuning the VF forks with emulators? Or are there better options?
• Did anyone play with fuel injection on these bikes yet? Maybe retrofitted FI from a later model?

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All the info you seek is contained in this site. You might find a kindly soul prepared to offer you a short cut but when I was in your position I used this site for all the research I needed to make an informed choice. Every question you ask has been asked multiple times before so the answers are out there.

 

On to the search function then...

 

Halfway 1985, Honda adjusted some stuff to change the engine characteristics, with a better focus on midrange. Does anybody know which frame codes or month I should look for? (I guess by then, the cam issues were solved too?)

No idea


If I end up buying a VF500F2, are the VF500 bikini-fairing body panels a direct swap?

no, the fairing mounts are different


Is the CBR600F4 shock a direct bolt-on swap or is a spring or damping adjustment needed?

No, it would have to be modified, check daughtry motorsports website.


How much shorter are the CBR600F2 forks compared to the stock VF forks? I can't seem to find hard info on that one. Can I swap the whole frontend or am I better off tuning the VF forks with emulators? Or are there better options?

no idea about the 600 stuff. I have racetech springs and valves in mine. HUGE improvement and made it the best handling bike I've ever ridden (along with the rear shock)



Did anyone play with fuel injection on these bikes yet? Maybe retrofitted FI from a later model?

no idea


Brakes

I replaced my front rotors with imitation Galfers from a seller on ebay and HH pads. Even with the 30 year old rubber brake lines stopping power is more than you need. It will easily lift the rear tire at 60mph if you REALLY lay into the front brakes. If I'd had those brakes on it when the woman turned in front of me I would never have hit her.

 

THANK YOU! Your shortcuts are highly appreciated

I will be looking for a late 1985 or younger vf500 then.
Looks like jamie is indeed "the man" when it comes to revised suspension for these bikes.

I am frantically researching fork types now, trying to find people who did an F3 frontend swap with this bike.

I used racetech valves on my last project and the results are indeed stunning.

I am researching frontends now mainly to get rid of the TRAC

Are you still using the stock calipers?

 

you don't have to use different forks to get rid of the TRAC, when you install the GVs it bypasses it. I used 10wt but am going to change it out for 20wt. The rebound is great with 10 but it's not what I like on the low speed dampening.

I'd recommend a rear shock that has adjustable length so that you can adjust rear ride height, especially if you're going to change to F2 wheels.

I also have a V30 Magna transmission in mine. lower 1st gear, 5th gear is the same as the VFs 6th gear and 6th is like a light OD. If you keep the stock wheels it lets you run lower geared sprockets for much better acceleration and the same rpm at highway speed or stock sprockets with better acceleration and lowered rpm at speed.

 

oh yeah, stock calipers. stock rear brakes, they are strong enough. I have these rotors and love them. Also have cheap HH Sumo pads and they work fine. The 500 is a light bike so it really doesn't take much.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-1986-H...Parts_Accessories&hash=item2585579923&vxp=mtr

 

Tinkerinwstuff, that is the most comprehensive and informative read I had on the V4 to date, awesome!

Commrad, is there nothing left of the TRAC after the gv install? Is the caliper still "pivoting" or whatever makes the suspension stiffer?

I did not know there was a difference in gearing for the magna, but it makes sense since it's a cruiser. I guess you used the inceptor topend because it produces better power?
Did you put the gears in your vf500 casing or did you swap the crankcases as a whole?

Good info on the brakes, that will save some cash

 

don't over complicate the TRAC unit, Honda didn't. It's basically a washer welded to the dampening rod and smaller transfer holes for the fluid. This directs some of the fluid through the TRAC system which is nothing more than another route for fluid that has a selectable orifice ( the knob with 1-2-3-4 or what ever) and a piston that closes when you hit the brakes so the fluid is restricted to the smaller than normal holes in the dampening rod. When you install the GVs you drill the holes out larger. I left my TRAC completely intact, it closes under braking and forces all the fluid through the GV like it should be.

I live near Tail of the Dragon and ride these mountains all the time, I assure you that there is nothing wrong with the stock 500 front with RT springs, GVs, better rotors, pads and tires.

Actually the Magna engine is identical, part for part. I sat down with parts lists from both engines, the only thing different was the trans and carbs. Even have the same cams so I just swapped engines.

Don't expect the 500 to be fast, it's never going to happen but it can be made to handle like it's on rails. Mine will eat my CBR1100 alive in corners with it's narrower and higher pegs you can get lean angles that other bikes drag the ground. A good friend and I did a track day. I took the 500 and he took his KTM motard, we passed every bike on the track on the outside with ease. If there hadn't have been straight sections we could easily have lapped everyone there. The guys on the 600s were in shock. We were too to be honest. Well there was that one guy there on an Aprillia 250 that passed me in a corner but he really had to work at it and only pulled it off once.

 

Ok the TRAC implementation makes a bit more sense now, I will research it a bit further. I have to admit that it's hard trying to comprehend this stuff without having a physical example in front of me.
Stock frontend it would be then, saves cash for other stuff.

The bit about the magna engine is AWESOME news, these bikes are plentiful around here, and I can probably score an engine pretty cheap. The magna is a lot more common than the VF, so parts are cheaper too.

I am not looking for a fast bike, I am looking for a good bike. I appreciate a good handling bike far more than a scary fast one. I learned to ride on a CB600 (the "599") that had it's engine tuned by it's previous owner. I shat my pants more than once on that one. Because of the stock suspension, it actually made me ride very "squiddish", slow corners and brute acceleration afterwards. I am very happy I sold that bike for one that had less power. (I did not wrench at that time)
I enjoy cornering fast, hunting ideal lines, far more than I enjoy kick-in-the-butt acceleration.
I also have a thing for light and middleweight motorcycles, they are much easier to have fun with where I live. No canyons here, but lots of very small countryside backroads.

Your input is highly appreciated commrad, I really hope I can start a project log here in the near future.

 

you're most welcome. not every Magna part is the same, the case covers are different, maybe the oil pan but the main components are the same. That's good news the Magna is plentiful there. You could keep a 500 on the road a long time with a good parts source.

If you get a 500 just be aware the stock suspension is terrible, the rear shock is down right dangerous if you push the bike hard in the corners. I replaced my rear with the Fox and finally found the limits of the front at about 80mph in a REALLY hard left hander. The front actually started skipping, lost about 2 feet off my line, luckily slowing down transfers weight to the front.

 

Yay, found a breaker that has LOTS of CBR F2 and f3 parts for what seems to be "below market average" prices. Multiple F2 wheels to choose from, lots of other stuff.

Second look into the TRAC system, I still might want to get rid of it completely. Even if I still go with emulators, removing the complexity of this system IMHO can only provide better reliability and less unsprung weight.
CBR F2 and f3 fork lengths (measured from top of upper fork tube to center of axle) are both 780 mm It seems that VF500F forks are 800mm.
Another user on this site seems to have successfully fitted a complete YZF600R front, which has 805mm forks. Unfortunately that means mismatched rims, and I'm not a fan of the 3-spoke designs.

I'm not virtually throwing out the VF500F forks yet, just thinking "out loud", meanwhile the fork lenghts are noted once more for people to find.

 

I see what you mean. But, I am still in the "research" phase now.
If I can swap a complete frontend, that would save me from machining the wheels, and would maybe open up possibilities later down the road. (brakes?)

I never intend to ride the stock bike "as is" (except just once or so to have a feel for what my starting point is), I will immediately start rebuilding/modifying it.
This means I choose one path and stick with it.

Either I go with the stock forks, F2 wheels, stock brakes, racetech valves, or a complete frontend swap. A cartridge type frontent can be found at around the same price or a bit more than a set of gold valves. Something in between is also an option, but I want to know what is available.
I would rather not decide on doing one thing and buying all the components, and afterwards decide to go the other route. That's expensive.

I need to know what is available at what prices, and decide based on price and advantages.

I am well aware of the dangers of both project creep (wrong decisions) and over-engineering/tuning (if it ain't broke..), and want to avoid making these mistakes.

In other news, just found a VF in the color scheme I want, and requested more info, maybe will place a bid later this week.