New member, new build! '97 VFR750

Discussion in '3rd & 4th Generation 1990-1997' started by Veedubklown, May 4, 2015.

  1. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    First let me say hi, I've lurked around here for a while as a guest, before finally registering. So much great info, and porn here, I had to join up, and share what I've been toying with.

    Back-story - First of all, I'm a motorcycle nut. I have a 1200 HD sportster myself;
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    but I love anything with 2 wheels and an engine. My buddy has this VFR, it sat for a while, after it got backed into, in a parking lot. It was a bit haggered out, before that, but then it became unridable. I told him I'd fix it, and steal the keys from him. He said that's fine, so BOOM! Free use of someone else's bike? Heck yeah!

    So, there was a crack in the right side engine cover, banged it back out to make sure everything had clearance, poured in some JB weld, holds fluid great. Straightened out the bars, got the throttle, choke, and other controls working again, bent all the pegs back out. His original intention, was to restore it back to it's former glory of 1997. He wanted to pay through the teeth for the original plastics, light housings, etc etc etc. Knowing his budget is more limited than his intentions, I showed him some of the great porn you guys, have here. Naked is the way to go! So, after the initial set of repairs, here's what we ended up with.

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    No idea what that top fairing was off of, but it looked like crap, and fit even worse. So, we went to this;

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    Because Zip-ties make everything faster. Even a custom tail-light and license light housing.

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    Yeah, it's ghetto. That's the idea, made me laugh. Fast forward a few days, and I've come back to town from a trip, and he's decided the gauge cluster and stock headlight, were "ugly", and that needed to be fixed. Which, led me to;
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    This was after I spent a couple hours, organizing and learning the wiring harness. It's still kinda at this point, that was a couple days ago, but I've been working it over to remove unnecessary systems, relocate a few things like the fuse box and relays, front coils, etc etc. More wiring fun tonight, as he works up buying new lights and mirrors for it. Personally, I love a build thread, so I wanted to show off where it's going and chronicle the progress. The rear frame will likely stay, as he's short, married, and of limited funds. The stock seat and height work well for him and carrying a passenger, has neat features like the helmet lock and release, and, it's no additional cost.

    Last night, was the removal of *most* of the PAIR system, and the carbon canister. Holy crap is there alot of vacuum ports to plug for those systems! I've not seen a block-off kit for the PAIR lines for the gen4, anyone have a link? I was considering just making my own with some sheet-stock and cutting a gasket. Anyone have a better way? As well as removing the rear lines, without dropping the engine. If I have to go that far, it can wait until we're ready to finish the frame, and I'll just leave the lines on, and plugged until then. You guys that have bobbed your bikes and harness, did you continue to use the clutch diode? Or simply tie off the connections? Really the only circuit that has been removed so far, is the kick-stand, as blinkers, engine info, and lights will still be used. I'm going to run lines for things like neutral indicator, idiot lights, etc, for when he gets a new gauge cluster, as all that stuff is pretty universal.

    All and all, I'm having a bit of fun, going through this. Thanks guys for being such an inspiration, and for checkin this out! Can't wait to do more updates.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2015
  2. ridervfr

    ridervfr Member

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    Bike looks nasty, like one of those junkyard mongrels :lol: you can cut off the metal tube and have a welder plug it. I paint mine a re-install, the bikes run better without all that crap. You know you gota plug the airbox as well as the carburetor plenums. Just saying, nice write up. I would do a carbureted sporty :vtr2:
     
  3. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    Oh man, it is nasty. He picked this thing up a few years ago for $1800, and looking at some of the deals I've seen on this, he over-paid, but, it's the bike he's got. And, mechanically, it's sound.

    Somehow, there's overspray, like, ALL OVER this bike. It's like the whole thing got a gentle misting of white, or maybe primer gray? It's stuck to everything, and well, looks like shit. The front fork seals are blown, which makes the whole front end look poopy. After we're done with the wiring, fork seals are likely next on the list, else I will club the owner severely about the head and shoulders. My sporty is a 92, with the CV carb. Actually made me feel kinda good when I got into this thing, and seen those familiar vacuum chambers.

    UPDATES!

    So, with some tools of the trade, this wiring shalt be muh bitch!

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    I'm starting to see this in my sleep

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    Sorted out the wiring, relocated the relays to under the seat and in front of the air box. Fuse box is going to be mounted under the seat. Saw another build on here that I REALLY liked, but one thing that made me scratch my head to no end, dude put the fuse box, under the gas tank! Blow a fuse? Guess I'll check under the tank! >.< Once I got the wiring sorted, pathing ran, pulled the harness out, layed it on a table, and worked it there. Because soldering on the bike, is just awkeard, and crimp connectors are for weekenders who can't solder. I'm an IT guy, this is the stuff I do.

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    It's a wiring harness, only if you *believe* it is.

    Without all the junk hanging from the sides.
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    The owner decided, "fuck all the plastics", a sentiment that I whole-heartedly agreed with, and was more than willing to jump all over. Less plastic repairs for me, or having to figure out how they need to attach. However, that means there's much less places to hide unpleasant looking stuff like the fuel pump and harness, itself. Also, we skelotonized the rear sub-frame, cutting out the bottom fender cover, and have started removing some of the mounts on the rear frame. I see alot of guys change the rear sections, and I'm thinking this one works pretty well, considering it's cost. May extend it up a couple inches, in the future, but, for now, it's just getting gutted. Working with plastic parts, are always fun. Fun fact - Dremels will throw molten hot peices at you, no matter where you hold your hand. Even if there's no perceivable way for debris to contact your skin, it finds a way.
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    The most worthwhile thing I did all day; Polish up the Honda logos.
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    However, you can see the effects of the skeletonized rear subframe, it gives a nice, airy, racey look to it. The essence of motorcycling, nothing but engine, wheels, some way to control it, and somewhere for someone to ride it. What else you need? I keep telling the guy, a tach and a fuel gauge are AMAZING, but, we'll get there.

    I did plug the airbox and intake runners, as well. That was what I was so amazed about, the number of ports to plug on this! For everything, there's 2, anyway, then you have the carbon canister system, AND the PAIR system, each with their own vacuum runs. FFS! Clutters everything up, this thing backfires like no tomorrow coming off the throttle, I believe from what I've read, it's from the PAIR system being disabled by simply blocking off the air-box ports, which is how I found this bike. Now, I've removed everything except the lines to the heads, which are plugged. I'll be excited to fire it off and take it around the block, see if it still does it. Probably next day or two, I should have the wiring back together and have this thing fired off. Who needs gauges, indicators, or lights?

    For sure, it's a junker to start, but eventually, he'll throw some money into it, and we can clean it up and make it decent, for next to nothing. Aftermarket lights are cheap, and he's gonna run without gauges or indicators until tax time, so I'm building that addition, into the harness.

    QUESTIONS!

    I have the PAIR lines just plugged for now, I hadn't considered using the existing lines as a plug, but I like it! I was thinking just some sheet metal or aluminum, cut to fit the opening, make a gasket, bolt it in? Would think it's no more difficult than making a paper intake gasket.

    Giving a look over these pics, can you tell me if those are stock handlebars? I'm thinking they're aftermarket, but honestly, this is the first sport bike, honda, or VFR I've ever worked on.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2015
  4. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    Here's what I've worked to accomplish, so far. Life has it's delays, and this harness kinda sucks. But, I'm making it good. Lengthen some things, shorten others, you know how it goes. Definately the easiest way to do it.

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    You guys that are running aftermarket gauges like a Koso unit, what speed sensor are you using? I see they come with a sensor that goes in the rear brake caliper, however if I can reuse the stock sender, I'd like to. But, if the resistances are completely different, I understand. Which leads me to another question, how did you block-off the stock speed sensor? Just snippin the wires and using the stock sensor as a plug is pretty trashy, so if cut a peice of sheet stock for a filler plate.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2015
  5. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    Got the wiring put together back to a state where all the systems work. Lights, horn, blinkers, runs, everthing.
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    Then, pulled the whole harness back out, and bound it back up.

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    Mounted the headilght relays, forward coils, and forward switch plugs all between the air box, and fan shroud.

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    Routed all the wiring, as cleanly as possible, to make it seem like it's supposed to be that way, from honda. The fuse box is going to mounted to the sub-frame, next to the battery, using the stock connector that was once part of the front sub-frame.

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    Put the ICM, turn signal relay, fuel relay and pump, all under the rear seat.

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    How it sits, now.

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    So, it runs. It does all the things it's supposed to do. It has no gauges, at all. I'm less than a fan of that, but, whatever. Dirt bikes don't need em, it's not going to need inspection any time soon, whatever. It does, however, run like shit. It's a combination of poorly plugged vacuum lines from all the emission systems that were removed, and needing intake boots. After I got it fired off, the slightest touch to the throttle, kills it. Spray some carb cleaner around under the intake maniforld, idles up. So, I need to pull the intake, and better plug the ports, and fittings, and replace the intake boots. Then, I can go from there.
     
  6. VT Viffer

    VT Viffer New Member

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    Pull the carbs and clean them. They're full of gunk, I guarantee.
     
  7. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    After pulling the carbs and inspecting the intake boots, they're still supple and crack-free. I'm thinkin the leak was from the vacuum ports under the intakes for the emission systems. Going to cap those plugs with some bolts.

    Now to just figure out on here, what hoses do what, and figuring out what needs to be plugged.

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    Looking at the carbs and hoses, I'm not sure the carbs need all the interlocking vacuum ports. Can I plug each carb port for the air hoses, and just let them run without the vacuum lines? They apparently are all a part of the emission systems, VOES and PAIR, whatever. Those have been removed, can I likewise simplify the carbs, or do I need to do as is done, and just cap the ends of the hoses where they would have went to the diaphram pumps and whatnot?
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2015
  8. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    So I figured out that most of those hoses are vents for the carburetors, and less vacuum ports. The smaller 3/8 fittings are vents for the carb float bowls. Plug them, the bike starves for fuel in a couple minutes of run-time. the larger 1/2 fitting that runs to the sub-air filter, is a vent for the vacuum plunger. If you plug it, it's essentially keeping them closed, makes it run super rich, and foul plugs. Those two fittings, need to vent to atmospheric. Once I figured out all the mess, it ran great. No gauges is weird, but, it's still really fun.

    I was nearly to the point of pulling them apart, however I didn't want to pick up a rebuild kit and gaskets unless it was absolutely necessary. Once I figured out what ports do what, it runs great. Before, the pair system was intact but plugged at the air box, there was a wicked backfire on decceleration. That's completely gone, now. I still have the hoses on the PAIR ports, but have them capped with some vacuum plugs, for now. I didn't want to bother with pulling the rear wheel and shock to get to the rear ports, at the moment.

    So, wiring is solid, carbs and fuel as well, and, it looks less shitty, so far.

    Now that all the mechanicals are sound enough, time to make it back to being legal. Needs some rear lights, some mirrors, and to mount the headlight better.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2015
  9. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    One thing that's realy been bothering me, is the PAIR tubes that were still connected. I'm not *sure* which caps plug the ports, I've heard hyabusa covers work, but not sure what years, or if there's a difference between them. However, I put a set of rubber vacuum caps on the tubes, and that works well enough. But, on to the fun!

    These are the offending pipes in question.

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    The front cylinders took me all of 15 minutes to remove, chop, and re-plug. Test ride, seems they'll work fine. So, onto the rear cylinders. Getting to those rear cylinders with the engine in the bike, is a BITCH.

    I just got this thing back together a couple days ago from the fiasco that was the wiring, and that whole phase. So, to pull it back down to *this* was a little scary at first.

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    Then I dropped the bolts in the bike, and had to roll it around, and tip it over, to make them fall out.

    Fuck it, building a drag bike!

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    Finally! They're out!

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    And, back together. Much better.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2015
  10. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    I had to throw a picture of these together to throw on craigslist for $20, but man I am glad to be rid of them!

    [​IMG]
     
  11. safetypro10

    safetypro10 New Member

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    Head ports are easily replaced with aluminum plate and gasket glue. Use original bolts, torque gently.

    And ditch those ugly rear head tubes.

    Personally, I would find an aesthetic way to cover the rear subframe as well.

    Good luck.

    Larry
     
  12. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    Yeah, some time if the vacuum caps fail or the motor gets dropped for refinishing or whatever, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. For now, getting those hoses back in sucked. The rear sub-frame is going to be re-worked to give it a different angle, eventually. So, for now, the skelotonized look is what's up.
     
  13. ridervfr

    ridervfr Member

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    Personally, I would cut that pipe to the shoulder and have a welder plug the hole up. There is heat associated with them and I would not trust rubber in that situation. There is a gasket too associated with these that you must use, looks like a "space-shuttle" gasket. :loco:

    You have to use a die-grinder or a small dremel to get to the rear cylinders, cut it off like a surgeon and your done, might need a fancy 10mm wrench to get to those bolts. Repeat above process for rear "caps" or what ever you want to call them.

    Your half done from there, you need to cap off the air box now. You can use rubber plugs that you get at the local auto parts store for this, like wise for your front plenums on your carubertors. Front two "carbs" operated the PAR valves through those hideous sucker things on either side of your engine.

    I have four brass spigots with hose and bolts on the ends to cap off the carburetor plenums. I did this mod on two carbureted honda v-fours and its worth it imho. Simplifies maintenance and makes the bike run better.

    You can paint those caps silver or black. My second bike I gots black and its better, not that its a beauty queen but its what I got. :vtr2: Cheers
     
  14. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    Yeah, I don't trust them myself, either, but for now, they work as a proof of concept. If they fail or I get a wild-hair in my ass, I'll correct it with more permanency. The gasket material is a high-temp gasket, similar to other exhaust gaskets or a head gasket.
    The air-box and intake runner vacuum ports were already plugged (poorly), when I started messing with this bike. That was part of the problem of why it backfired so hard. The vacuum pumps on each side of the frame, carbon canister, mounts, hoses, etc has been removed since I started on the wiring. Figured, I'm already here to simplify things, these are going, too. When I cut those tubes, as easy as they cut, I assumed they were aluminum, but now that I've hit em with a magnet, I see that they can be welded. I'll take em down to a buddy here in the near future and have him put a bead in each one. The brass spigots on the intake were capped the same way you were saying, and during my process of figuring out why this thing was running like crap, when I hit those with some ether, it would idle up. So, I capped them off with vacuum plugs.
     
  15. desktopdave

    desktopdave New Member

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    Nice build! I like it. I'm not sure removing 20% of the bike can figuratively be called a "build", but I digress...

    I'd recommend something like these Emgo universal fork clamps and a standard 7" round headlight just to get it on the road. Maybe something cheap & round off a CB400 or CB750, along with some LED signals. I prefer the larger 7" size just because IMHO it looks right... I've tried out the LED H4 headlights and I was pleasantly surprised. They are definitely good enough for me.

    Those are definitely not stock bars. Nice rise on them too - anyone know what they're from?
     
  16. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    We can call it "rebuild", then, as deep as I've had my arms in this thing, and down to it's bits. That just doesn't have such a nice ring in the title :eek:nthego:

    I'm just reattaching the stock light to the forks and trees until the owner wants to bother forking out for a new light setup. He likes the dual 4" rounds I have on my sportster, but also likes more modern shaped stuff. Whatever, up to that guy, I'm just the dude putting it together.

    The bars used to have set-bolts in them that allowed them so much rotation, but not to go forward beyond a certain point. I removed that, so they could go a bit wider, and get good use from bar-end mirrors. Really dig the bars.

    May as well throw a quick update. I've been daily-riding this thing since about July, and it's been top-notch. The power of this thing is just, absurd. Compared to the 1200 sportster I've been used to for years, this thing is a whole new league. I'll tell ya, harley guys HATE when you sit there and go on about how good a honda is, and then proceed to smoke the fuck out of them. It's great fun.

    So, I found a stoney set of bar-end mirrors on Amazon, for like... $13? for the pair. The owner specified, "Not rounds", and I said, I can deal with that.

    [​IMG]

    Put a cheap intigrated tail-light on it, I think that was about $18. The trailer light the owner had wired in origionally failed, and to replace it, was like $12. So, new tail light assembly, it is. Oh, it's from China, and made for a european plate size... Hmm. K. This can work.

    [​IMG]

    Also retied the headlight, so it sits more stable, and doesn't rub on the forward subframe mount when I turn the forks. Also, I kept blowing caps off the PAIR hoses, ROFL. So, I put them in a vice, crimped them shut, then flowed some solder down the tips. Nay an issue, since.

    It's fast, running, reliable, legal(ish), wicked fun. This is pretty much how it's going to stay until tax season, when it can get a Koso gauge cluster, a new headlight, and maybe some other fun stuff, see how the bike fund looks. Cheers, buds!
     
  17. RVFR

    RVFR Member

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    Wow! talk about a another passionate build adventure, bringing a VFR back from the dead, props to you... Nice.
     
  18. desktopdave

    desktopdave New Member

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    They are tremendous bikes, aren't they? Once I get some adjustable bars on mine, it'll be perfect. Then I'll have to start looking for a parts bike, I guess. Great work so far! Please post your Koso install (after Uncle Sam lets you have some of your money back).
     
  19. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown New Member

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    I just don't understand why all motorcycles can't be this fast, torquey, well balanced, comfortable, handle so well, stop so good, and be so cheap? My harley has spent more time in the years I've owned it, waiting on parts or repairs, while this thing... Just goes like stink. It's frustrating, to say the least. Don't think I could ever let my buddy sell this bike... I've grown quite fond of it.

    For sure, as updates roll around, I'll grab pics and throw em up. My next adventure, will probably a trip to the car wash. Just hate when a build thread stops, without the dude being like, "Yo. Ran outta money. Check back in 6 months.".
     
  20. rhoderage

    rhoderage New Member

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    Great restore; particularly impressed with the wiring harness, as that is a very time-consuming pain in behind kind of task. Anytime someone goes full bore on their harness like this I think it shows true commitment to quality.
     
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