FI blinks rapidly, engine won't start

Hi!
I own a '02 honda VFR 800 and there is a strange problem. FI blinks all the time, with no stops, approximately twice as fast as it should report an error code. There are clicks heard from the ECM, like something tries to start but can't. (See video) The engine won't start and I have no idea how to deal with this. Could you help me?

 

Hi Vitali and welcome to the MadHouse

When you get a chance please drop by the "Introductions" section and say Hi to the rest of the folks on here and tell us a bit more about you and perhaps add a photo or two of your VFR.

In the meantime - my initial thought is low (possibly dead) battery because when the battery volts fall too low, the fuel injection system cannot operate. There is no specific code linked to constantly flashing FI light - so what you see is probably a generic warning that the volts are too low for the PGMFI system to operate. On that video I could not hear the FI pump priming - rather suggesting its an electrical issue.

So what to do? My first suggestion is to eliminate the obvious. So test the battery volts or at least recharge it overnight - then see if it starts.

Alternatively you could just see if it fire up OK when you connect up jumper leads from a car (BEWARE THE CAR ENGINE MUST NOT BE RUNNING). If the bike then starts OK - you are probably just the latest person to suffer from the electrical gremlins which affect these bikes.

(If not you probably need to get the bike to a motorcycle dealer)

This link

https://vfrworld.com/threads/how-to-fix-common-regulator-stator-failures.39277/

describes the most common charging system issues which these bikes suffer from and what you need to fix them.

BEWARE do not assume that fitting a new battery will solve the problem - quite often a drained battery is actually caused by faults elsewhere in the charging system - especially the Stator or Regulator/Rectifier(RR).

Good luck - let us know how you get on.



SkiMad

 

Hi, thank you for your response!
I will definitely go to Introductions, but now I have only garage photos, want to capture better ones first =)
I charged up the battery, it didn't help...
Disassembled the bike a little further - it's Fuel Cut Relay that's clicking. Engine Stop Relay seems to stay silent. Does it mean that I should check fuel pump? Could you suggest what may cause the FCR to go off?
And one more fact that may help, the engine starts up sometimes, after long delays. The engine runs for a second or two, then FI starts blinking again.

 

Ok - your mention of the fuel cut relay means a few things spring to mind.

The FCR is part of the safety interlock system designed to shut down the engine and fuel pump after an accident to reduce the chance of a fire. The safety interlock uses inputs from the kill switch and various sensors to also prevent potentially dangerous events - like trying to start the bike if the bike is in gear and the side stand is still down - and that is the system I would be carefully checking over. The basic function and wiring schematic is shown in this digram which hopefully will allow you to locate the problem.

http://www.lifford-cooke.com/motorbiking/documents/VFR VTEC PGM-FI Diagram 2002.pdf

You do not mention the background to this problem - which may aid people miles away to offer better advice. So the obvious questions are was the bike running fine? Did you buy it with problem? Has the problem appeared after you had work done on the bike? Has the bike been dropped or in an accident - or stolen and when recovered it was not working? Depending on your answers that may allow you to focus on specific areas rather than check the entire interlock system.

I would certainly start by removing and checking the FCR is operating correctly (not jammed) and also ensure the bank angle sensor is fitted correctly as shown in the manual.



SkiMad (who is about to go offline - for several days on my VFR)

 

I bought it 2 weeks ago, and it run well for 600 km or so. Engine was a little unstable at low rpm (up to 5000) - I thought it was a synchronization issue. The engine could stop when I was waiting at traffic lights (this happened 2 or 3 times) - but it could start again with no problems. The last time it happened, the engine started for a couple of seconds and the blinking begun.
Do you know where the safety sensors may be described? I have a manual in my hands, but the FCR is mentioned only in general wiring diagram.
I found that the relay voltage (Bl/W vs Br/Bl) is 10v. Battery and headlights relays voltages are 12v though. Is it ok or it should be 12v there? Does it mean I have a leak somewhere?

 

So finally back home after another 2,500 miles on the VFR, and able to respond.

If you open the PDF file which I linked to in my second post above - you should find all the information needed to locate the various components on the bike and the wiring schematic should allow you to test it is all happy.

I am however very worried by the mention of 10volts - once again I suspect that this is actually just another dead or dying charging system problem. The fuel pump will NOT prime if fed just 10 volts. The relay should be delivering at least 12 volts and once the engine is running that should rise to 13+ volts. Assuming you have not done any modifications to the bike wiring then I doubt the low volts is due to a "leak"- something shorted out - as you say the starter was turning over - obviously if it was simply jammed - then that would be worth checking - but I rather fear you have one or more dead components in the charging system - I will not jam up this thread with stuff extensively covered several hundred times before especially as it is all covered in the thread I linked in my first post.

Suffice to say PLEASE don't assume "charging the battery" is a reliable test for the charging system - you need to load test a battery. The battery terminal volts with the engine off and key out - if it is below 12.4 volts you are wasting your time - just fit a healthy fully charged battery (borrow one if necessary) or as I said earlier hook it up to a car battery with jump leads (BUT DO NOT HAVE THE CAR ENGINE RUNNING) If the pump primes and the bike fires up OK then you know its a charging system problem you are dealing with.

PS I have never heard of a FCR relay failing - but I guess there is always a first, however it is a fairly simple relay to bench test - supply 12 v DC across the trigger terminals and check that the relay closes and power will pass through to the fuel pump. Have a look at the wiring schematic in the PDF.

Hope that helps.

SkiMad

 

Did you have fun with the Oldies - lol

Yep great advice..

CHECK FOR SIGNS OF BATTERY OVERCHARGING ISSUES FIRST

DO NOT INSERT A BRAND NEW BATTERY FIRST.
Please ensure that your REG / REC is outputting the correct voltage first - charging a crappy battery to do the test first is a better way of not cooking a brand new battery if the charging circuit is kaput.

They can fail on the earlier models..