‘94 comes to life

Discussion in '3rd & 4th Generation 1990-1997' started by Toddman, Nov 9, 2019.

  1. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    this may be copywrited and I hope Jamie doesn’t mind but this is a page of instructions for installing the fork inserts. He also offers seals which I purchased. The fish oil (that’s old school for fork oil) wash purchased from my local Honda dealer.. the good seals are green and look trick. The inserts included the springs and spacers for my purposes.


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  2. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    Am I boring you guys or do you have specific questions?
    The shock is a nice piece of work. Again setup for my weight and riding style. The fluid reservoir will mount under the battery. Being a track bike only, there will be a lithium battery. Also saving another 4 lbs or so. 0960009D-1DA7-4002-AB18-96B70A018900.jpeg 0E5DCAC6-911C-4252-BF04-5BB51DA0A6F5.jpeg

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  3. Diving Pete

    Diving Pete Insider

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    Whats the weight of the front calipers & mounts?
    Why change the original brakes?
    If its for more power then going up in disc size would have seemed the more obvious & easier choice.
     
  4. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    Well if you up the rotor size your stock axial calipers mounts will have to be changed too so you’d be faced with the same mounting situation. Try thinking of it this way...
    When you are on a racetrack, your index finger is pretty much poised to activate the front brake . When you enter a corner you have two choices. You can scrub speed off by sliding both ends or you can simply tap your front brake and drop 20 mph quickly. When the front brake is used at these speeds, an axial style caliper will heat up quickly and chatter and grab. Radial brakes however, push the pucks out from both directions. It’s a very smooth bite on the rotor and is equal from both directions. There’s no twisting action and there’s no vibration. Less heat, less weight and better feel. It’s a win win. There’s a reason why every sport bike that you can buy nowadays has radial brakes.

    I didn’t think that changing the calipers would make such a difference in feel, but it did. With two fingers I can raise the rear tire off of the ground fairly easily. The axials would lock and slide the front tire instead. You need that kind of feel at the track to really improve your lap times.


    Look real close at the front brakes on the GSXR on the cool down lap. Those are 6 puck Tokiko (sp) axial brakes as that is a front end from a 2001 gsxr1000. Even though they were 6 puck, only 3 pucks actually moved. The three on the opposing side were pulled over. The front tire would bark three times going into the turn 3 hairpin on every lap. Properly setup radials won’t lock the front tire, they will lift the rear right off of the ground if that’s what you want.

    The front brakes are a system comprised of three components. The master cylinder, the calipers and the rotors. Those system need to compliment each other in a way that is detrimental to your purpose. This build is for a track/research test bike to see just how good, or bad these changes will be. In the end, this will be a street bike but there’s no better venue than the track for testing. The changes that are made now will be incorporated into the street version and so far it’s working pretty well.

    I can’t give you exact figures on the weight. Just by holding the two systems in my hands they felt similar in weight. Even if the Brembos weighed slightly more (which I don’t think they do) the benefits still outweigh (mind the pun) the minor difference. I just can’t tell you how much smoother the brakes are. You’d have to experience it firsthand.

    thanks for the good question.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
  5. Brian Rodgers

    Brian Rodgers New Member

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    Todd, great stuff.
    I'm also an older (56) rider and also planning some modifications to my '97, so this is all good stuff.
    Please elaborate on "radial" brakes vs "linear". I'm not sure what you mean and I'm not versed in track lingo at all.
    Do you know how much the track version of this bike is or will weigh vs stock?
    Brian
     
  6. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    Since we’re talking about the wheel/brake assembly let’s talk tires. There are a lot of good tires out there. I like Michelin slicks but for cost effective-ness, Bridgestone makes a good tire. The BT16 is what I use. They last me two track days. I keep them heated all day. Between sessions the warmers go back on. Tire warmers don’t only affect the tread, they keep heat all the way to the wheel, the core so to speak. Here are some on that 1000r. I’ve read articles on tire chemical composition and from what I gather is keeping the tire warm makes it feel new longer. They called it heat cycles or um snake oil. Lol. All I know is the stones are plenty sticky (I can melt them on the gixxer, lol) and I like sticky tires. They also have a forgiving profile and are usually wider than most. I tend to run the tire pressures what the manufacturers state hot.

    ...for your enjoyment...




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  7. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    Yes Brian,
    Axial and radial mounts are, simply put, different bolt patterns. Axial mounts have the mounting bolts parallel to the ground. The bolts are positioned this way because the calipers need strength to pull the pads from the other side of the rotor. Most cars have axial mounts. There are two pins that are also parallel to the bolts that the other pads are connected to.
    Radial calipers however, have the mounting bolts running down through the calipers to the mounting surface. The bolts will be in a radial position parallel with thE rotor. The radial caliper doesn’t depend on pins carrying the opposing pads as the caliper pushes the pads towards the rotor using fluid from both sides of the caliper. When the pads squeeze the rotor, the caliper follows the rotor instead of pulling the rotor over to meet the opposing pads.
    Don’t misconstrue the two operations. The both work dandy and they both provide great stopping power. It’s just that the radial design doesn’t malform the rotor because it presses equally on both sides at the same time. Better feel and a smoother transition and for sure less heat buildup in the rotor.

    We will be weighing the bike this weekend. The weatherman says we will have 60 degrees on Saturday and they have scales at the Hallett track. We will take some good pics and maybe a video or two.

    I see what’s confusing you now. The VFR forks are built with axial mounts. The hangers convert the axial mounts to convert them to radial. Notice the two chrome bolts going through the forks? Axial. Notice the two large Allen bolts going down through the brembos? Radial.
    But remember, even though the axial mounting does exist on this setup, the functionality of the Brembo radial design uses no pins. It squeezes from both sides and follows the rotor up. This does pull the rotors to the side somewhat but the front fender and a fork brace is all it needs.

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  8. RllwJoe

    RllwJoe Member

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    All good stuff. I'm enjoying following this project. Keep up the good work.
     
  9. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    A little about carbs. This seems to be a big subject because to replace the carbs is pricey and with the advent of fuel injection, jetting as we called it in the 70s is becoming a lost art. Jetting was the root of all evil for me. I rode a ‘79 KZ650SR Kawasaki back then. It was brand new, midnight blue and ran like a top. But those pipes!,, Fugly was a good word for them. Kerker made a real nice 4 into 1 black header for all of the Kaw 4’s. Now, I knew that I would have to re-jet and the House of Kawasaki wrenches told me to go up one main jet size, maybe two. That would have worked well but oh no, I HAD TO HAVE THE POD AIR FILTERS. If there are older guys out there reading this, they too are laughing at this point. A month later and taking the carbs off more than 10 times, it finally dialed in to a respectable bottom and the top end was much stronger than stock. You see, when you change the amount of air so drastically with separate pod filters, the the 1/4 to 1/2 throttle opening was bizarre and tough to get right. A combination of pilots, needle and main jets ensue into a frenzy of configurations even Beldar would approve of. MIPS MIPS...I digress.
    That’s how I learned about “jetting”. When I disassembled the downdraft carbs on the VFR, the configuration was familiar. I don’t have a sonic cleaner so we took all the rubber and plastics off and boiled the hard parts clean. With guitar string the cleaning was straightforward (thanks Squirrelman) and they went back together without a hitch. #3 kept fowling and you know the story there (#3pilot jet inadvertently was reamed out). The moral of the story is this, all carbs need to be CLEAN. If you are rebuilding, it’s a good idea to buy new jets because when you clean the originals, they will be larger than stock. How can they not be after running fuel through them for 30 years. Physics demands that this will happen. The tolerances allowed for jet holes is miniscule and must be addressed. Air intake is going to change also but not as drastically. If you take the snorkel off, more air is introduced (possible jetting change needed). New and different exhaust or a slip on perhaps? Possible jetting change. Different air filter from stock, you guessed it... as Squirrelman says, make everything stock and go from there. You have to find a base and work from that. If you don’t have a base, it is a bizarre nightmare that will never end. Well, maybe not that bad, but you get my point. I don’t have a good carb pic so here’s a ‘76 900LTD that I restored years ago. It too had carbs. LOL. 94D4AD18-7626-46EC-BCC5-FBF8766F473D.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
  10. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    This build has been going on for two years. If the motor holds up (I have no reason to think otherwise) the VFR will be a substantial toy and would be super fun in And around Hot Springs and the copious amount of great mountain roads near Eureka Springs, Arkansas. A good picture of the R Yoshimura slip on. There’s a power commander in there too. I was told that some of the body would be finished tomorrow but I’m not in a hurry there. Tidying up the electrical and adding some “home made” skins takes time.

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  11. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    E9B5C5E9-6823-4A07-BFFD-D31038632DD6.jpeg D551CD0B-2EC6-44F8-957E-75F3344016F2.jpeg There are some details that have to be addressed if you are going to a track day. Good tires, no leaks, not too loud, full leathers, helmet no more than 5 years old, back protector, gloves (I lucked onto a pair of Dainese soft leather gloves for $80 years ago) and boots.
    A catch pan/fairing under your engine, safety wire and most all riders keep their bikes clean.

    I’m fresh out of small fairings so,,,,,,a piece of a fender and two parts of an old fairing might make a bill at least to cover where a headlight would be. That’s all wiring underneath.

    if you look long enough on the internet, you can easily find unfinished late model plastics for the big four and Ducati for $125 shipped. They are white plastics that can be melted together. I use a $45 soldering station with a 500 degree heat gun. There’s a nice Hakko iron on the wiring table. The cheapo iron gets to melt plastic. This is a self taught method. Pretty simple, wide tip on the iron, stitch across the seam. You hold the iron 90 degrees from the seam and melt halfway through straight down. Lift, move over 1/8” stitch...etc. I like to tack first. When it is stitched all the way along the seam, go to the beginning of the seam, lay your iron down towards you and slowly drag the stitches across each other. You know, butter it. It won’t break. A wire wheel will get rid of most of the slag. Finish with a small amount of bondo. There’s something about bondo you need to know. It takes three applications to get it right...haha. I don’t know why really, it just does. Solder,sand,bondo,sand,bondo,sand,bondo,prime,sand,paint. You get fast after about 30 years.
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  12. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    a shot of the dual outlet Pingel fuel valve / petcock. They wanted $50 for the mount so I made one and threaded it. There is an o-ring in between. Simple. Subframe installation and wiring. Basically laid out like the original. The plastic under tray tomorrow. Every part and fastener is selected with strength and weight in mind. Use titanium and aluminum everywhere you can. Parts fabbed from these materials are extremely light and strong. Learning to weld them is something different entirely...bwahahaha. Aquiring a tig welder is a step in the right direction. Tigs offer a lot of control. CB74A253-11F1-4CA0-8049-112DC91A4D9D.jpeg


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  13. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    Went to the track . A good time was had by all. This suspension with new tires is great. Very neutral. No wobble or weaves. E572E268-8FA0-4B16-8284-5BE020649D0A.jpeg 2DCDC52F-2719-43B7-90B8-24C0E718BFCC.jpeg 3559BD93-1576-4225-AB1A-1636793CF345.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2019
  14. Toddman

    Toddman New Member

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    Since we've discovered that the engine is going to live and the suspension is excellent, There will be good data on fitting a fairing to this bike that came from a newer motorcycle.

    The tins are coming back from paint. I snuck this one out before it has been polished. Again these are for a 2004 1000rr so it is important to keep certain aspects of the bike. Smaller tank, seat, etc.
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    Recently a fuel tank from a 2004 has been ordered. The design is vastly different from the 1994. The track bike doesn't need a large tank. This is the tank cover from the '04.
     

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    Last edited: Nov 29, 2019
  15. William Tyler Houston

    William Tyler Houston New Member

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    Thanks for sharing, this bike is beautiful. So did you do any painting/polishing of the wheels/motor/forks or has it always looked that good? My forks are wind beaten, black paint is chipped off my motor, and my rims need a new paint coat. I'd love to know what you did to restore these parts. Thanks.
     
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