Lithium iron phosphate dead

Discussion in 'Mechanics Garage' started by VFR Love, Nov 3, 2014.

  1. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    My old battery was shot - came with the bike. So this guy I know hooked me up with a new lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) battery. I put it on my trickle charger (battery tender jr) as per his direction for about 25 minutes and then installed it. Bike fired up great and I took it for a spin for about a mile, parked it outside and that was it.

    A month has gone by and now it's dead. Like 2amps on the multimeter dead. I left a cell phone charger plugged in but nothing connected to it. Maybe that's why??

    I hooked up the battery tender jr and it's apparently not detecting the battery at all because it's flashing red which means no battery connected.

    I have another charger that puts out 6 amps. Is this perhaps what I need to connect to get some juice into the lithium iron phosphate battery so the trickle charger will recognize it??

    The battery is a Ballistic Evo2 8 cell 4.6 amp hours according to the website and the box says 49.2 W/hrs.
     
  2. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    I have had to do that before, I flatten out a gell battery and the trickle charger wouldn't bring it back,10 mins on 6 amp charger and then the trickle charger would work
     
  3. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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    If you haven't already I'd read through the FAQs page on Ballistic's website. They have detailed info about about charging & conventional charger use with their battery. Personally I'd buy their EVO charger. A conventional charger designed for a lead acid battery may stop charging at 12.8V. The ballistic battery at full charge is 13.2-13.7v according to their website. Plus their charger can balance the cells.

    Consider the climate your in too. Their battery doesn't perform as well as lead acid in cold weather. If its getting close to freezing at night in your area that could be the reason for your dead battery.
     
  4. Outboard John

    Outboard John New Member

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    I was thinking that perhaps the new battery only had a surface charge to begin with, 25 minutes charge at low amps and then only a mile of riding doesn't seem it could have gotten a full charge.
    John
     
  5. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    I hooked up my 6a charger to the battery tender leads on the bike and popped a 5a fuse on the positive lead going to auxiliary lights. Does this mean anything?

    So I removed the battery and it's registering 4a on the charger which is switched to 6a. Watching it like a hawk.
     
  6. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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    You said the Battery Tender Jr's light was flashing? Was that with the battery in the bike? If so I would double check the charging leads. The light will flash if the leads are reversed & will flash if the battery is defective. At this point I would remove the battery & attempting charging off of the bike. Time for a close inspection of the rest of your bikes electrical system.
     
  7. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    Correction: the 5a fuse is not connected to aux lights. I'm not sure where it goes yet.

    I put the battery on the 6a charger for 7 minutes. Voltage read 12.5. I checked and cleaned connections and reinstalled and after a couple of cranks the battery dropped to 10v.

    Hooked up the battery tender and it's once again flashing red.

    Pretty sure the old battery was kicked from age and a few discharges while I worked on the bike previously. Unless it's like was said I never got the full charge into it to begin with??
     
  8. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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    From Ballistics website: If your EVO battery will not start your bike, then the first step is to charge it! EVO batteries have a lot of special qualities, but at the end of the day, they are just batteries and they can become discharged for several reasons, just like any other battery. We recommend checking voltage first. The minimum charged resting voltage of an EVO battery is 13.2 volts. If your battery is not at least 13.2 volts then your battery is not charged. You can view the charging instructions here. The best way to charge an EVO battery is with a Ballistic EVO charger. After the battery has been charged correctly, let the battery sit for a few hours. It should settle to between 13.7 volts and 13.2 volts.
     
  9. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    Problem is I don't have the proper special charger:( argh new technology!!!
     
  10. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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    They really don't give any info about testing other than static reading w/ multimeter. Not sure if its worth the time but most auto parts store offer free battery testing. Of course its entirely possible their testers can't properly test that battery. You could call Ballistic & see if their customer service has any info about charging.
     
  11. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    The plot thickens: I pulled the battery from the bike this time while running the tender and it's working. Already picked up another regular battery. Ack this is killing me. Weather is unreal today and so few nice days left this season.

    How can I check my charging system??
     
  12. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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  13. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    Anythings possible. And my buddy said it's likely there is a draw and to check the rectifier.

    Thanks for the link- I'll check things out and report back.
     
  14. NormK

    NormK New Member

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    7 mins on a charger does nothing but give it a bit of a shock, then put it on the trickle charger for probably 12 hours and it should come back to life
     
  15. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    Multimeter defective- deleted post
     
  16. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    I'm thinking it was my cell phone charger that drained the battery over 4 weeks time. It has a small LED plus whatever it draws.

    Here is the difference in parasitic draw with and without the cell charger connected:

    ImageUploadedByTapatalk1415176092.128427.jpg ImageUploadedByTapatalk1415176104.215722.jpg

    Can anyone qualify that idea? The difference seems drastic but I have really no clue!
     
  17. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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    I hate to keep beating this drum, from Ballistics website:

    Although EVO batteries have incredible energy density and they can burst more cranking amps than a conventional lead-acid of similar physical size, they have less amp/hours. Amp/Hours is the ability to deliver a small amount of power over a long period of time. This means that if you typically use electrical accessories when the vehicle is off, a lead-acid with more amp/hour capacity might be a better choice.

    The Ballistic EVO batteries are designed to be used as starter batteries. EVO batteries typically have much higher cranking amps than the stock battery, but less amp/hours. What this means is that if you have a lot of additional electrical accessories that draw from the battery when the vehicle is not running, an EVO battery will discharge quicker than the OEM lead-acid battery.

    According to the Honda shop manual for a VFR (2002) "Specified Current Leakage: 2.5mA max."
     
  18. VFR Love

    VFR Love New Member

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    Not at all. The first thing I did was read the FAQ. Good stuff but doesn't help I don't have a special LIP charger and I might have other things going on.

    And, with electrical diagnostics I am woefully inexperienced.

    So is that milliamps I was reading? Like .05 and 11.71 mA?
     
  19. Arnzinator

    Arnzinator New Member

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    Hit youtube for some meter basics, plenty of great tutorials. Your not going to diag an electrical system w/o power. If the tender charges the battery out of the bike but not in the bike then I'd suspect something wrong on the bike. Can't see your test leads but your getting a reading on the 20mA scale so I think you did the test correctly. The fact that there is a huge difference w & w/o cell phone charger is obvious. I'd completely remove it from the bike. Especially since ballistic states that battery doesn't handle a parasitic draw well. But thats your choice. The fuse that blew on the bike, was that fixed? Have you determined what circuit thats for? If that fuse keeps blowing then you have to take a look at that circuit. If your going to stay with the Ballistic battery consider buying their charger. I don't know what you paid for it but the retail on its not cheap. If a specific charger can extend the life of it I'd say thats a no brainer. Since reg/ rec problems are so common on theses bikes look at the connections from "The Drill" link in post #9. If theres signs of charred connections then that needs to be addressed.

    If your unsure about the draw test heres the page from the Honda manual.
    Draw test.jpg

    Be careful when testing amps with your meter. Meters are fused. Usually theres two outlets for testing amps on a meter. Hard to tell from the meter in your pics but it looks like one outlet is for 10A & the other is for 200mA (?) Is isn't hard to blow a meter fuse. Everybody's thats done electrical diag has probably done it. At least once or twice. ;)
     
  20. kennybobby

    kennybobby New Member

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    Heart of Dixie Georgia Boys mighta been usin' dat
    Yes that is the correct reading.

    If the charger is drawing 12 mA, then in one day if pulls 0.288 A-Hr. And in one month (30 days) it would deplete your battery trying to pull 8.64 Amp-Hrs.

    i would recommend to not leave any loads such as this on the battery.
     
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