New & Improved Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Anything Goes' started by tinkerinWstuff, Jan 31, 2021.

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  1. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    You sure love to take every little statement and run off the deep end with it don’t you?

     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2021 at 10:42 AM
  2. jethro

    jethro New Member

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    Ivermectin is for use in humans as well as a horse dewormer. The difference is the dose and India has had great success with it. If people here were getting treated early with it there wouldn't be the load on the hospitals. Read up on it and quit listening to the msm.
     
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  3. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    Won a Nobel Prize for it’s use in humans

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivermectin
     
  4. rhoderage

    rhoderage New Member

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    If the climate changers are correct, there are already too many of us on the earth and we will destroy it. I got nothing to say to that, no doubt its true, but I won't live long enough to see it so its not particularly important to me. Oops, yeah I said it.

    That said, why don't we just ease up and watch? I believe it used to be called survival of the fittest; those who adapt best to their environment will thrive while those who neglect to adapt will perish. I don't want to see 20% of the world die, that does nothing for me, BUT if these folks are insistent then let them make their decision and take their chances. If a significant number die off, and the remaining ones are either immune or somehow less likely to get sick from covid (clearly i'm not a scientist), then at the end of the day you end up with a population of vaccinated and covid-repellant people. Thats the ultimate goal anyway. You can spend all day trying to convince these people they should or shouldn't, but they are going to make their decision, and some (many?) want to just be the polar opposite of the masses just because! You literally can't fight that. There will always be people who rebel just to rebel. I say educate them, give them opportunity and support to get the vaccine, and if they choose not to then OK they've made their choice.

    We still allow smoking don't we?
     
  5. reg71

    reg71 Poser Staff Member

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    @rhoderage we could follow that and just watch, but what do the hospitals do when people who chose not to get vaccinated are overcrowding? Do they turn them away so the beds stay open for heart attacks? Do they start turning away smokers or non-helmet wearers then? Where is the line on choosing which stupid behaviors we support and which we don't?

    I'm not offering any suggestions just frustrations.
     
  6. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    What’s preventing the system from adding capacity? At the beginning of the year, Colorado had (if memory serves) 466people in ICU. We also had emergency hospitals setup up that were never used. Now there are 260 people in ICU and it’s reported that we are at 103% capacity. If we have half as many people in ICU as we’ve had less than a year ago, how is the system over “capacity”?

    No doubt there’s smart people running these hospitals but this type of reporting causes folks like me to scratch my head and go whut?
     
  7. cat0020

    cat0020 Trumper

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    I read everything as it is written, don't you?

    I never mentioned the word Ivermectin in my previous post. Please read more carefully.
    Can you provide a source that supports your claim for India?
    how many have recovered or survived from COVID because usage of Ivermectin?
    What specific dose was used for the Indians infected with COVID?
    Could it be that India is using Ivermectin to treat humans because of COVID vaccine shortage?
    Americans using Ivermectin are clogging up hospital beds according to FOX NEWS:
    https://www.fox9.com/news/ivermecti...nesota-in-august-amid-covid-19-misinformation
    What is msm?

    By winning a Nobel Prize, that makes it safe for human consumption to treat COVID?

    From the exact same Wiki page you posted about Ivermectin:

    Further information: COVID-19 misinformation § Ivermectin
    Ivermectin has been pushed by right-wing politicians and activists promoting it as a supposed COVID treatment.[74][75][76] Misinformation about ivermectin's efficacy spread widely on social media, fueled by publications that have since been retracted,[77][78] misleading "meta-analysis" websites with substandard methods,[79][80] and conspiracy theories about efforts by governments and scientists to "suppress the evidence."[81][82]

    In response to widespread misuse, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, U.S. Centers for Disease Control, World Health Organization, American Medical Association, American Pharmacists Association, and American Society of Health-System Pharmacists issued statements in 2021 warning that ivermectin is not approved or authorized for the treatment or prevention of COVID-19, and advised against its use for that purpose outside of clinical trials.[50][83][20][84]

    On September 1, 2021, health experts from the United States expressed concerns from reports of sharp increases in outpatient prescribing and dispensing of ivermectin with respect to levels before the pandemic.[85] These experts explain that the CDC has not authorized or approved ivermectin for the prevention or treatment of COVID-19.

    Maybe go volunteer at your local hospital and find out the answers for yourself?
    While you're at it, ask them about the usage of Ivermectin to treat COVID.

    On the topic of over population: there are plenty of children already in this world that nobody want;
    there really ought to be a test for folks to TAKE & PASS before bringing another child into this world.
    Who conduct the testing I don't know, but as an EMT I've seen the corpse of a 2 months old in a microwave because mom was trying to stop her baby from crying.
    You can be pro-life until your wife is told by the doctor that her pregnancy is non viable, her baby has no kidneys or a brain and will most likely die before birth.
    Under new law he cannot remove the fetus, even if it is stillborn, and your wife is forced to follow through with the delivery.
    You get to watch the fallout of her having to tell family friends, co-workers, over and over what is going to happen when they ask her when the baby is due.

    You can be pro-life until the doctor tells you and your wife that she will most likely die if the pregnancy is brought to term, along with the baby.
    Your future, your soulmate, your everything will likely disappear in less than 1 year and nobody can help you.

    You can be pro-life until your wife has a miscarriage, and doctors refuse to remove the rest of the fetus citing the new abortion laws and your wife is likely to die of sepsis.

    You can be pro-life until your daughter is raped, and you're forced to watch her suffer through her pregnancy, on to have her die in a failed attempt to abort at home.

    Not your body, not your choice.

    There are many different circumstances other than those above.
    It doesn't always mean what you think it means.

    Not one bill makes a man step up and be a responsible dad, this is not OK.
    I agree it's not a form of birth control, but a woman should be able to decide on her own as it is her and her alone who has to deal with the decisions.
     
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  8. reg71

    reg71 Poser Staff Member

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    Mostly it's staff preventing ramping up. Most everyone I know that is at the bedside is burned out. Many have quit. Some have died, but the frustration is real. My sister is an NP in rural Missouri and she is constantly battling misinformation and trying to convince her patients to vaccinate or at least wear a mask in crowds, but she says they are convinced it's impinging on their freedom. She is pro freedom, but she is also pro vaccination.

    It gets sticky when your freedom steps on other peoples rights. I think most businesses have a sign that says "no shoes, no shirt, no service". Isn't that pretty close to saying hey, no vaccine, no mask, no service? Does the business have the right to protect it's workers by asking that?

    Are some freedoms sacrificed if you live in a society? Am I free to endanger people by driving 100 in a 55 mph zone or is there a mandated speed limit?

    I just know that as someone who works in healthcare, it's really frustrating to hear things like there is an international conspiracy to microchip people via vaccines. As if, the international community could ever cooperate on that level.
     
  9. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    have you ever wondered why it became cool to wear helmets in ski culture while helmets were mandated for motorcycles and became a freedom of choice and personal responsibility hot button issue?

    If we told people, “your body, your choice to risk life and death while us cool people gonna go survive over here…” more folks would come around. None of us are any different than we were as a terrible two year old rebellious human.
     
  10. reg71

    reg71 Poser Staff Member

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    I never thought about the ski helmet thing...until I concussed myself on a mountain. :) That sounds a little dirty.
    Interestingly, here in Missouri they repealed the helmet law. Contrary to what you might think, I am ok with that. That being said, if I am getting up above 30 mph, give me my helmet thanks you very much. The wind noise is terrible without a helmet. Yours eyes water fiercely, too.

    Does your auto-insurer have the right to charge you a different rate if you are a known non-helmet user? Does your medical insurance have the right to cut your life-support short if you had an accident not wearing a helmet? i don't think so in either case which must mean that those of us who do pay taxes are somehow footing the bill in some form or another.

    I fell like I'm just rambling at this point. I must be on VFRworld. Back to Facebook where everything makes sense... :)
     
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  11. Gator

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    Well put. You can also add that we are not losing millions of people to Measles, Mumps and Rubella because we make kids get vaccinated. Looking at it from a simple mathematical point of view you really need to get the population vaccinated or disruption and shit will keep hitting the fan for years.
     
  12. Captain 80s

    Captain 80s Member

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    The "coolness" didn't happen over just a couple seasons. It took years of PEER PRESSURE from friends, family, news stories and even stranger's looks. And even tho I wear a helmet skiing (and believe in the benefits), I still don't think it's cool. I fucking look like The Great Kazoo from the Flintstones. I'm sure if my 11th birthday present was a ski helmet and a season's pass, and a mandate from my parents it will be worn if you want to ski, my opinion would likely be different. A full face helmet on a sport bike looks cool tho, but my 16th birthday present was a Freddie Spencer Arai and a cash-match deal to get a 500 Interceptor, so I'm biased.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021 at 8:06 AM
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  13. jethro

    jethro New Member

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    cat it was you who mentioned a horse dewormer for covid and Ivermectin is the only one I know of that is being used. You implied it. My sources are the doctors that are putting the information out trying to save more lives. There are lots of drugs that are able to treat covid, but for some reason none are being approved for that use, so people are needlessly dying. There is no need of an emergency approved vaccine when there are drugs that treat the disease, but the FDA and cdc won't give any approvals for those drugs. It's criminal if you ask me. MSM is main stream media.

    And no one ever mentions natural immunity from having covid, nope still have to get vaccinated.

    There was a nurse on today and I don't remember if she worked in the icu or emergency room, but she said 80 to 90 percent of their covid patients were ones who had been vaccinated. I also know of several people that have died from the vaccine and others who have had cardiac problems afterward. Covid is treatable and I would rather take my chances with that than a vaccine the government is pushing that can cause major problems. The mortality rate from covid is around 1% and that isn't worth getting all worked up about. I'm strengthening my immune system and I will be fine.

    Alot of the issues hospitals are having are self induced. Back when covid started they stopped doing all the normal stuff hospitals do so they let staff go. Now they are firing nurses who won't get vaccinated which worsens a staffing problem and puts more load on the nurses still there which is a good way to cause burnout.
     
  14. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    oh, what to believe.....

     
  15. Gator

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    He said she said, there is so much wrong info here I don't even know where to begin. Is there shenanigans going on? of coarse, always has been always will be. I have pretty extensive contact with doctors and nurses in a wide variety of fields along with big pharma too. There are a lot of agendas out there no doubt. But spewing unfounded claims is becoming rampant.
     
  16. cat0020

    cat0020 Trumper

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    Just what are your sources?
    who are those doctors? can you name names from your source?
    which medical school did they go to? how many years of practice do they have?
    are they specialized in infectious diseases in humans?

    Maybe FDA do not approve of them because they are not meant to treat COVID specifically?

    What's criminal is: celebrities, news show hosts, radio hosts using their platform to the masses and giving medical advices without proper medical background during a deadly pandemic.

    Do you honestly believe that natural immunity can adapt quicker than a virus among population who are not vaccinated?

    Breakthrough infections are possible, doesn't mean that you skip the vaccine and get at least some protection.
    Do you know the mortality rate for breakthrough infection?
    Can you supply a source that show mortality of COVID is around 1%?
    Do you know how many Americans need to die if mortality is around 1%? 3 Million.

    Hospitals are asking for voluntary dismissal of those not willing to vaccinate because they know they know the risks.
    When staff get sick, not only they risk infecting the patients they come in contact with, but also their co-workers.
    Hospital lose revenue paying out sickdays, the sick employees rely on provided health benefits that ALL other working employee also pay into. Eventually hospital will need to pay higher premium, trickle down to higher co-pay for employees.

    https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/16/us/florida-vaccine-advocate-family-member-deaths/index.html

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021 at 4:36 AM
  17. Gator

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    Never let truth stand in the way of a good opinion...... especially one from a real Voodoo doctor. Or a chiropractor that is more versed in disease than life long virologist. Hell why not do what some said, direct bleach injections, it works, I read it on the internet. For fucks sake, this is really getting out of hand.
    "My doctors are smarter than you doctors, and my scientist too". The real medical community and scientist are at wits end with this shit. I know to many people that are sacrificing so much to help and being badgered while doing this. I also know a lot of people that have lost loved ones, and not just old folks.
    Using a crisis for gain is evil, no matter your political affiliation. Want to do something constructive? Quit throwing gas on the fire, maybe bring some food to a family that just lost their 34 year dad that they didn't even get to see as he was dying.
     
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  18. reg71

    reg71 Poser Staff Member

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    As someone who has worked in healthcare for over 25 years, I can state point blank that we have ALWAYS had required injections. The only way to avoid them has been religious reasons or allergies.

    This is no different. Anyway, choosing this hill to die on (pun intended) is doing so for another motive.

    Every doctor I know is vaccinated and recommending vaccination to everyone (except kids under 12). If you have found one that isn't and doesn't say to get it, then you must have really searched them out or someone did for some reason. I just don't understand the motivation to challenge the evidence so vehemently. It's not logical.
     
  19. jethro

    jethro New Member

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    Pandemic response has 4 legs to it. The U.S. is not doing the 3rd leg which is early at home treatment. When diagnosed they send you home and tell you to take tylenol and then when you get bad and can't breath you go back to the hospital and they put you on a ventilator. Once you go on a ventilator the odds are against you. This could be prevented with early use of Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquin, Budesonide nebulizers treatments, and others I have heard of. Ivermectin and Hcq are cheap and effective if given early. The doctor in TX. cleared his hospital of all covid cases in 4 days using the budesonide nebulizers, but I'm not sure about cost on that one. I guess a world renowned French virologist that came up with the Hydroxychloroquin treatment is just a voodoo doctor. Yeah right. These doctors are going out and looking for ways to save lives because they were sick and tired of seeing their patients dying and the CDC and FDA's line is there is no treatment for covid. People are getting better treatment overseas than we are here. Fauci even knows that hcq is effective against coronavirus because of a study done under his auspices around 2005 that he just conveniently forgot about when Trump mentioned it. The government agencies are against the American people. Ask yourself why the vaccines are the only thing being pushed and other countries have treatments and the vaccines aren't doing the job very well either.
     
  20. cat0020

    cat0020 Trumper

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    What to believe? believe in yourself, like I mentioned in my previous post, go volunteer at your local hospitals for a few shifts, get to witness first hand what it's like to be on a ventilator due to COVID.
    If you're smart enough, ask or manipulate some questions when you get to ask the doctors or nurses,
    maybe you can make them answer your questions to suit your narrative or agenda like Megyn Kelly, certain members or Congress or other TV, media, radio hosts, etc... Make up your own story based on "facts" about COVID.

    Can you offer any sources to support your claims?

    Who are these people that told you this COVID pandemic has 4 response legs to it?

    Who declared that US is currently is in the 3rd leg?

    Who sent you home once diagnosed and told you to take Tylenol? does that apply to everyone who is infected?

    Who is this doctor in TX? which hospital? do you have his name? is he a infectious disease specialist for humans? how many patient did this doctor treat? what specific dosage?

    What are the sources that tell you to use Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquin, Budesonide nebulizers treatments, and others for early treatment? can you supply more than one source that support those treatments?

    Can you give an accurate or even estimated number of how many actually got better with the treatments that you mentioned? any sources that can support those same numbers?

    So far, you've made many claims in your posts, but supplied zero sources, zero specific name of doctors, zero specific numbers of patients to support your claims. To me your posts just seem BS without specific details or sources to support your claims. Am I being too honest?
    Maybe it's because I have seen the trailers full of bodies in America, where I live.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2021 at 3:14 AM
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