Project VF500F2

Discussion in '1st & 2nd Generation 1983-1989' started by shields17, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. Captain 80s

    Captain 80s Member

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    Nice!

    If you need that little bleed hole cap, let me know. I have a bag of them.

    Oh wait, I forgot where you are. :)
     
  2. raYzerman

    raYzerman Member

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    You can always drop a Canadian quarter in the reservoir, it will prevent backsplash. Then you have a choice, leave it in there or fish it out with a magnet. Yamahas don't have the little clip...
     
  3. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    You'd be a very rich man here, all the UK sellers are selling them over £30 each. I appreciate the thought though!

    That's a good tip, thanks. I guess anything that covers the hole partially will do the trick.
     
  4. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    More done today. Started off finishing up some bits from yesterday routing new clutch hoses and building up the footrest hangers. Both sides are now complete except from a badly beaten up footrest rubber that I'm awaiting a replacement to arrive. After I got those done I installed the new front sprocket and nice new shiny chain, albeit held on by a cable tie for now until a new chain rivet tool turns up.

    [​IMG]

    Then went onto the exhaust which turned into a bit of a battle. Between getting the clamps on facing the right way and the front downpipes fully into the collector it had 2 of us lying under the bike trying to fight them on. I'm sure there's a knack to it if you do it often enough! Running Marving silencers for now until if/when I can find an original for the left side

    [​IMG]

    Tomorrow the paint on the clutch slave and sprocket cover should be dry to get those fitted. Then onto clutch and brake fluids and hopefully get the cooling system filled... might even manage to get it started!
     
  5. straycat

    straycat Member

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    Canadian quarter and a 5 pence piece are the same size.
     
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  6. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    A day of problems...

    Firstly the rear calliper was a real struggle to get fluid to move through, eventually it started to go through but wouldn't build pressure at all. We decided to leave it and move onto the front in hope that leaving it to settle might help the air move itself up the system. The front bled really easily and built good pressure, the lack of cover for the bleed hole didn't seem to make it too difficult you just have to be careful not to pull the leaver in too quick!

    Sadly a puddle was forming underneath the rear as we finished up today, which explained why we couldn't get any pressure in the system. I checked the bleed and banjo and it definitely wasn't from there... so unfortunately one of the pistons is leaking. I'll take it apart tomorrow but as it was a new pistons and seals I'm hoping the calliper isn't junk...

    The clutch is also proving difficult, it didn't want to bleed at all. It would build pressure but only once. So as soon as you crack the bleeder it seemed impossible to build pressure again. Weirdly though we then left the bike for a break and when we came back the clutch seemed to have way more pressure behind it, but difficult to test how well it's working without the engine running.... This is my first time dealing with a hydraulic clutch but I'm treating it exactly like a brake, am I missing something?

    My chain tool also arrived but I think it might be too small. Seemingly no matter how hard I tighten it it won't make the rivet flare large enough to be in the chains spec. It was a cheap amazon special so maybe a bit of get what you pay for...

    Advice or experiences on any of this would be much appreciated!
     
  7. squirrelman

    squirrelman Member

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    you'll get the best clutch bleed if you remove slave from sprocket cover and hold the piston fully retracted using a C-clamp.......then make a nice cuppa tea.
     
  8. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    This worked brilliantly, thanks!

    I've now disassembled the rear calliper again and the seals looked fine, both seated properly, not twisted etc. I soaked them both in brake fluid and reinstalled them both and the piston. Sadly still leaking from that piston. The pistons/seals are not OEM, they're from TRK Braking. Is there any chance it's a dodgy piston/seal and not the calliper? I have a spare calliper so that's in the ultrasonic cleaner at the moment so I can try to rule out the calliper.
     
  9. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    Spent most of today chasing my rear brake leak. I tried once more dissembling, cleaning and rebuilding the calliper... no joy.

    We then noticed the rear calliper wasn't moving square to the disc and eventually tracked it down to rear brake carrier. I believe the set up I've got is a Daugherty Motorsports conversion kit for the F2 wheels, but the mounting plate was running at an angle to the disc. I was searching for information on here to ensure I had all the spacers in correctly and came across an old thread with similar issues. What seemed to be suggested was that the torque lug on the swing arm sticks out too far for the kit and can cause the carrier to be pushed out of true when the axle is tightened.

    I checked my Dad's bike which has run these wheels before and sure enough the swing arm had been modified. We debated swapping the swing arms but for the work involved it seemed just as easy to modify my swing arm as well. It's only 1-2mm that needed removing

    [​IMG]

    Once that was done I tried the rear calliper again. I figured the calliper not pushing straight may have pushed the pistons to one side enough to cause a leak. Sadly this wasn't the case and I still have a leak... on the plus side at least the leak made me spot the hanger issue.

    I then took the calliper apart again and did what I should've done at the start... I measured the pistons and they both measure 29.96mm, well below the Honda service limit of 30.14mm. I checked an old piston to ensure it wasn't an error with my Vernier calliper and that measured in spec. I'm guessing I've been sent the wrong kit for the rear. The sellers shut until the 28th now though so going to have a bit of a wait to get this one resolved.

    There was some positive progress though, I borrowed my Dad's fuel tank to try and get the bike started and it fired straight up and is sounding really good! Having the tank on makes the bike start looking really close to rideable again!

    [​IMG]

    I've got a few niggles to chase down:
    -It sounds like the exhaust has a slight leak somewhere. We couldn't see it leaking anywhere though which is odd as we had a lot of smoke pouring out the rear of the exhaust from oil that had been put in the pipes before they were stored.

    - My temperature gauge didn't move at all when the bike ran. I've test the gauge by grounding the wire and it's working fine so the issue must be with the switch. Stupidly I fitted a lower temperature fan switch than stock so the fan comes on at a lower temperature than the thermostat opens. So maybe I didn't get the bike hot enough for the thermostat to open and fluid to get through to the temperature sensor.

    -The rear light has also lost all power for both parking light and brake light. It was working before so I think something must've got caught fitting the tank/seat and hopefully an easy fix.
     
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  10. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    I've had the bike running a few more times today working on the issues I found and it's sounding really good. It has started up straight away every time so far. It has a very slight hanging idle but hopefully get rid of that once I sync the carbs properly.

    Temperature gauge is now working, turned out I had a bad earth, probably where the frame was powder coated.

    I've also found my exhaust leak, the front left downpipe isn't seated far enough into the collector box. Once the bike has cooled down again I'll slacken everything off and have some fun trying to persuade it in further.

    No luck with the rear light so far, the connections in the tail of the bike are all okay and the bulbs look fine. Looking at the wiring diagram it doesn't look like they have any other junctions so I'm really hoping something hasn't been crushed by the tank. I'll take it off for a better look once I've got rid of my exhaust leak.
     
  11. squirrelman

    squirrelman Member

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    power to the tail light comes through the ignition switch, so start testing at the plug there, brown wire most likely, and brake light could have a bad switch.
     
  12. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    Ahh of course - thanks! I had the clocks back off the other day as well so it's possible I snagged one of the connections at the front.

    I considered the idea of a bad switch but ruled it out as neither front or rear switch works now and they both worked fine before. I also get no tail light so it seems more like a total loss of power to the rear light.
     
  13. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    You were spot on - dodgy connection from the ignition switch! Cleaned up and put back together and now the rear light is back.

    This was a stupid thing to say... I went to start the bike to check the exhaust leak had gone and it just kept turning over but wouldn't start, just the occasional cough or pop from the exhaust. Conscious that I'd been messing with the ignition switch connections I pulled the plugs to check I still had spark. The rear two were a little loose so I suspect that wasn't helping things. I do have spark on all 4 though. All the plugs were pretty wet with fuel as they came out so I think I flooded it initially when I kept trying to start it. I've left the plugs out to try and let the engine dry before trying again. Fingers crossed it was the loose spark plugs stopping it from starting.
     
  14. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    Got a bit more done to the bike yesterday.

    The replacement brake pistons arrived so all 3 callipers stripped and rebuilt again. Now both brakes holding good pressure and no leaks! As the front callipers weren't leaking with the out of spec pistons I guess the rear calliper is just slightly more worn inside and the slightly smaller piston size allowed just enough of a gap for the fluid to get through.

    I also started to check my fuelling. I can't get the bike to idle at a stable RPM and when reved it has a hanging idle. I thought it may just be out of sync carbs but I hooked them up to my gauges and they seem spot on. I'm thinking the bike may just be running really rich as it starts really easy and when I pulled the vacuum lines off any of the carb gauges the RPMs shot up quite a bit.
     
  15. quasiff

    quasiff New Member

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    My VF500F has an unstable idle and over 50,000+ miles I haven't managed to cure it. I tried the usual things and some not so common. It's tolerable so I just live with it.

    Do you have a spare swing arm you'd be prepared to sell? I'd like to try to see if I can stiffen one but I'd prefer to experiment with one I'm not using.

    Are there any replacement stiffer swing arms available for the VF500?
     
  16. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    Yeah I've still not had much luck with mine and as it is I don't think it'd be rideable. Adjustment to the mixture either way doesn't seem to make any difference to the idle, it just continues to fluctuate and hangs high for a few seconds when revved. Carb boots were brand new and I can't find any leaks there either. I still think it must be running rich as when I run it on an external fuel tank as the fuel runs out the bike revs up by around 2-3000RPM.

    No spare swing arm - sorry...There seems to be plenty about on eBay etc, it's just a case of trying to find one that doesn't have the big scuffs in either side from the footrest hangers. I'm not sure about any alternative swing arms but sure someone on here will know if there is and if it's worth doing!
     
  17. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    Had some time this weekend to try and tune up my running issues. Unfortunately the bike would not start at all again. I pulled the plugs and they were wet with fuel so I figured I'd just flooded the engine again. I dried them off with a blow torch and left the cylinders to air out whilst I recharged the battery to try again. Same result - the bike would cough on the starter but would not start.

    I had a spare spark plug so I put that in the cap and the bike was producing a spark. I tried a few more times to start it but nothing.

    I've now pulled all the plugs again and none of them are producing a spark (the spare plug sparks on all 4 leads). 2 of these plugs were new last time the bike wouldn't start and the other 2 definitely produced spark. From a google there doesn't seem to be anything electrical that could cause 4 plugs to all go bad. They're all iridium plugs if that changes anything.

    I have a bit of a theory but not sure if I'm going in the right direction... Could it be that the bike is just running so rich and not ever getting hot enough to burn the carbon deposits off that the fouling has stopped them producing a spark at all? The bike has 42 pilot jets fitted and the mixture screws 2 turns out. With the stock exhaust collector and repro Marving end cans I'm guessing this is making the bike on the richer side at idle?

    I've tried brake cleaner/wire brush/blow torch to clean off the carbon deposits but they still aren't creating a spark. Any ideas of where to go next would be much appreciated!
     
  18. Captain 80s

    Captain 80s Member

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    In my opinion 42 is too large for an unmodifed 500. You can try and run the screw in a bit, but a 40 is the sweet spot.

    Get yourself some cheaper DPR8EA-9 too. What heat range are the plugs you're running?
     
  19. shields17

    shields17 New Member

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    Okay thanks, I'll see if I can improve things with the mixture screw. I believe these carbs may have been tuned to a K&N filter, I have a generic pattern air filter in the bike at the moment. Would it be likely gain me enough extra air flow swapping to a K&N or do I just need to commit to pulling the carbs off?

    I have DPR8EIX-9 in at the moment. So just the iridium equivalent I believe. I'll get another set but just go for the standard plugs this time.
     
  20. Captain 80s

    Captain 80s Member

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    The K&N might help a bit, but I still think #40 is where you need to be.

    Throw the K&N in and turn the screws in and see if things at least get better, and youll know you're on the right path.

    Edit: I may have misunderstood thinking you already had the K&N and switched to a paper element.
     
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