Spiegler Highbar Upgrade Nearing Completion

Discussion in 'Mechanics Garage' started by BASFjon, Jun 8, 2009.

  1. BASFjon

    BASFjon New Member

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    It's nearly done. I'm working on a set of custom risers right now. For the mean time I have been getting by with a riser relocation plate sandwhiched in between the LSL supplied Clamp and LSL Risers from LSL's VFR Kit, ...oh and the higher Streetbike High Bar mated to it.


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    What riding a Vif looks like with the High Bar Upgrade.
    FYI - 6ft for comparison sake



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    Before with the Factory Clip-ons


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    Spiegler LSL High Bars



    In short, because this was very involved in getting everything figured out, what I needed to get this done was the following (and I am still in the process of completeing it):

    • LSL VFR Superbike Handlebar Kit, less the Superbike Low Bar LN01 (29"), less the riser (so basically just the Clamp, Riser Caps and Bolts)
    • LSL Streetbike High Bar AN01 (33") - eventually having this powdercoated Silver
    • Custom Riser that locates the bar back a further 5/8" from the Superbike Riser LSL supplies - still working on and using a relocation plate in the meantime.
    • VTR1000F Master Cylinders for both Hand Brake and Clutch - practically elimates the huge problem I experienced with the stock Cast-in Reservoirs from the VFR's Master Cylinders from crashing into the Windscreen and Fairing - cannot be done without these.
    • Custom Mounting Bracket for the VTR Hand Brake Reservoir - reduces the small bit of scraping on underside of right fairing pocket under windscreen.
    • Trimming off VTR Clutch Reservoir Cap Securing Clamp/Fastening Assembly - not really needed, must be a Honda thing (well for racing an events possibly) - required because it shares space with the fairing pocket and the black inner plastic cover.
    • Very Minor trimming to undersides of fairing pocket black plastic covers (these are the plastic covers just to the inside of the windscreen and connect to the instrument cluster cover) - about 1/2" is all that was necessary and cannot be noticeably seen looking at the cluster.
    • Matching Black Hand Levers purchased off eBay in Black finish to match the VTR1000F Black FInished Cylinders and Reservoirs.
    • Extending Throttle Cables approximately 7 inches using a bracket to extend the original thottle cables forward and a second bracket to attach to it to replace the original cable fixture bracket (was easier then reusing and the mounting centers were out of allignment as cables were pointing a different direction and rubbing coming out of the cable housings) - required because the cables were too short, and access to the side of the airbox is cramped - therefore the extension bracket to locate the cables back further is a miracle when adjsuting the cable lengths.
    • Cable "Narps" - these are brass barrel ends that I found at a cycling shop in town - they allow you to adjust the cable length because they have an inside hex-head set screw. I cut the original factory cable barrel ends off, purchased a cycling brake cable, cut lengths and crimped each new one to the factory throttle cables, then ran the cut ends through the Narps that were already set in the throttle arm, pulled the ends through tight, clamped down the set screws on the cables, and cut and trimmed the ends with a dremel.
    • Rerouting the Throttle Cables, moving wiring bundles over, some with zip ties, various small adjustments here and there for clearance down below.
    • Disconnecting and Rerouting the Clutch Line Hose around something I can't quite off just remember - but the hose is more then adequate in length. Both Brake and Clutch Hoses run straight down with a slight inward bow off the bars - function much better this way.
    • Modifying the Factory Bar Ends to fit the 0.55" ID (Inner Diameter) of the Superbike Bars - I used a grinder to trim the already existing inner mating part of the bar ends that feed into the factory clip-ons - then resued the factory bolt placing a piece of rubber hose from autozone that was 1/16" larger then the factory fastener - cut this about 3/8" long, and then placed a simple flared face nut at the backside. How this works is - you place this inside the bar, then crank down the end of the screw/fastener - and this draws the nut into the hose piece, and it bulges - causing a positive amount of holding pressure against the inside of the tube holding it in place.
    • Making Custom Bar Weights for the Handlebar to keep the original solid feel - this was done by using a rather long bolt with the same weight as the original clip-on weight (for those of you that don't know - not only is the bar-end a weight, but there is another weight inside the bar that the bar ends screw into)... I used a Bolt from a Honda Civic Engine Mount (cannot remember which one in particular because it was in a bolts box from days past) - Chopped off the Bolt Head, ground the flat cut face and deburred, then incrementally drilled holes in the center to get them large enough to tap a 6mm x 1.00 Tap through the middle about 1-.25 inches deep. I then wrapped them in vinyl electrical tape and untaped them, cutting the tape off one turn at a time, till they were just large enough to slip in snugly. I inserted the factory screw fastener into the bar end, slipping the 3/8" rubber hose piece over the fastener on the other side, and inserted the entire thing into the tube, threaded it till the hose was just at the point of expanding, pushed the bar weight in further till the bar end was seating on the fillet I ground at the Handlebar End, then Fastened it together.
    • To position the handlebars correctly - because there is no recommended installation marks - you need to sit on the bike like you were riding with it on the centerstand, and pull back on the bars to center them, then lock everything down - except the switch housings - draw them down snug enough not to bend the plastic - because they have a locating dowel, and you cannot drill into the handlebar until you know what angle of adjustment on the bar is absolutely the best - this requires trial runs taking a set of hex keys, and 8mm and 10mm wrenches with you. Run down the hardest roads when you are the most sore or tired and you will be able to tell the correct position. What you are looking for is the soreness across the bottom center of your hand to disappear - from a bad angle of handlebar allignment - that is the best way I can explain it. It took me about 3 days to get it figured out down to road-testing and 4 or 5 twenty-minute trips down poor condition country roads. Now with a marker, mark the positions where the bar is set right up against the riser caps - when you are all down, I would take a razor blade and make small slices in the bar's finish to mark off the horizontal position, and nicks in the sandwhich area to the baskide where you don't see them - for the rotation of the bar position. ...Now, once you've figured out the position - position the switch assemblies on the handlebars where you want them - and make sure that they don't rub the fairing pocket too much. I have about a 1/2" gap between my grips and switch assemblies on the handlebar to make the fitment work - so expect this. The hand lever position is barely affected by it sliding over just a bit. Make certain at this point you ahve the hand levers at the level you want them - this is pretty important. Then use a marker to draw lines on the bars to mark where the switch housings were positioned - marking the halving points. Then you take them apart, hold the bottom to the marked halving points, and figure out where to drill the dowel hole. This takes patience. If you dick it up - your going to have to use JB Weld, fill in the area, and then redrill it. This isn't that bad of a thing honestly - because nobody will see it, and the JB Weld is nearly as strong as the alluminum bar. Once these are seated, put everything back together to the drawn marks and test ride it. Make sure it feels right, if not, go back and do it again. Reason is, on a long trip - it will start to bother you or cause soreness.
    And that is about it. I figure I am at least 4 inches backward horizontally and another 4 inches vertically. I would say my hands are now spread about another 3 to 4 inches wider outward - which does wonders for your upper back and back stiffness - that drawn in feel is horrible anymore when I ride my friends bikes for any length of time - you can breath so much better this way. I also have a lot more low speed stabiity, and I mean creeping low speed stability and control. Much improved. Cornering takes a bit of lowering your chest, like as if you were in a bench press holding the bar coming down (for comparison) and a different shoulder input to steer agressively - actually I like it better now over the factory setup. Coming to a stop is a godsend. I used to have to come up off the bike it felt - actually like sitting up by extending my arms some, and extending my legs outward to catch the weight of the bike just a bit when it leaned more to one side or the other. Now I just set my feet down at the stop. I can't really translate how much more controlled and better this feels. But I think it's way better!! And only so because the VFR is naturally top-heavy at low-speed. Wind Protection is kinda different. I am running a Givi Touring Screen on my VFR. I think the wind is a bit more buffered out and the strength is a bit lessened further back now - but the roar is still in the helmet I use. I am looking into a second Screen to mount to a spare OEM Screen Midway up with a fastening method like an FJR mounts theirs to the Cowl Support Frame for extra strength - this is going to take some time though and probably not look terribly right - but it's just to get behind a better pocket of stable wind and to widen the face of the screen to reduce the side-turblence as height has only a third of the significance to do with wind protection - it's more in width then height, and this seems to only be the way to do it. That will be the next big project. ...But the wind protection is about the same as before, sitting up mroe straight doesn't really seem to change it too much (maybe because you're further back??). The only thing I did notice, was that, and this especially goes for hard sport tires, your ass is gonna feel the road a lot more because you're more planted on it now. Go with a more forgiving tire like the factory one or a sport-touring tire. This is a Sport-Touring/Sport-Street setup now, and you're going to want to either go with a more forgiving tire or make that suspension change that is necessary on a VFR to reduce the nervious reactions to road imperfections. You will feel more of it. But it simply takes some getting used to if you decide to stick with the factory suspension. The only reason I state this is because I went with Continental Sport Attacks over Road Attacks after my OEM's wore through, and the amount of shock transmitted through my Corbin Seat seemed to increase two-fold.

    When I get the new Risers made and some more details drawn up on the risers - which I am planning on making drawings off all the parts needed and perfecting the cable extension bracket, I will post them. I will also post pictures of the new risers and the final install as well. And if I ever get a chance, video it as well from a bystanders point of view while moving.

    Hope everyone enjoyed this. This has been in the works ever since last August.


    Detailed Pics of the Install

    [​IMG]

    This is the Vif as it currently stands. Still working on the Custom Risers - has the Relocation Plate Temp Installed to get by. The Cruise Control Mounting Bracekt and Temp Mode Switch installed to the left side are also in work and slated to be redone, so it's partially completed as well


    [​IMG]

    You can see the relationship of the Reservoirs to the windscreen and fairing pocket sides pretty well here. You can also see how much further I have moved the bar back with the relocation plate - a total of 3/4 inches


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    Closeup of the same pic - here you can see the Split LSL Clamp that comes with the VFR Kit


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    VTR1000F Clutch Master Cylinder and Reservoir. This is the only Hydraulic Clutch Cylinder and Reservoir Combination that would work for this setup. It was an exhausting search that took a good three weeks and sizing mockups and so forth to find. Radials Cylinders are too long. Anything else would have meant a clutch cable


    [​IMG]

    VTR1000F Hand Brake Master Cylinder and Reservoir


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    Tight Fit of the Top of the VTR1000 Brake Master Cylinder in the fairing pocket. Hence the required trimming. Still need to make a custom bracket to reduce some rubbing from the Reservoir Mount Bracket - ordering some new plastic pieces as well - these were cut to clear the non-relocated risers. Note this is only tight when manuevering in parking lots or when parking the bike.


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    Another Pic of the VTR1000 Brake Master Cylinder and the Outside of the Fairing Pocket


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    And a Bird's Eye View


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    Here you can see how the Fairing barely rubs the Clutch Reservoir. You can also see the Mounting Bracket Swept back design and how it was fastened to the Clutch Lever Flange. Since this was hit or miss, turning miss because it is too long, and the later added Temp Mode Switch cramping the wiring space inside - there will be a complete redesign here shortly. The gap to the left side of the bracket is where the last plate was to be epoxied on. The wiring routes through the bottom as does the switch.


    [​IMG]

    Bird's Eye View of Clutch Side


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    Close Proximity of the VTR Reservoir on the Clutch Side


    High-Bar Installation Comparison:

    [​IMG]

    This is a true comparison of the riding position between the FJR, Connie, BMW, VFR and VFR with a Spiegler High-Bar (not to be confused with the Basic Spiegler Kit for the VFR). I borrowed this from a magazine article and superimposed the Factory VFR and Modified VFR Riding Positions. If you notice, in this picture the Red VFR Riding Position has bent elbows due to the widened handlebars. At 33 inches wide and the position of the hand grips, your elbows naturally sit at this position - and I have found it to be relatively comfortable. Also as a sidenote, the angle of riding position here also varies as you can slide aft and foreward on the VFR's seat quite a bit.
    .
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2009
  2. BASFjon

    BASFjon New Member

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    Here's a bit more why I went with this upgrade. Wind Protection for the hands.

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    These Handgaurds are Barkbuster Storms. They are worth their weight in gold!!


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    Not only do they protect you from the cooling effect of wind and moisture or jsut the plain cold, but they keep your hand protected from June Bugs, Rocks, etc. I also purchased the VPS Alluminum Backbone. I can ride into tree branches with these and at the most only lose the cover if it was big enough. And they double as hand protection in the event of a slide or crash.


    [​IMG]

    Now the Left Side Gaurd isn't positioned properly because of a clearance issue with a brake line - hence the spacers on the end of the handlebar, and the spacing bracket near the brake line. (Left side is right in this picture.) Spiegler has some custom lines that will bridge outward and get rid of the banjo fittings at the same time - that will be my fix. These were briefly installed for a 70 mph run down the highway with my gloves soaked in water just to make sure they worked. And they sure did. No wind at all.


    [​IMG]

    They mount on the handlebar ends and towards the center. I am looking at grinding down notches and such for the OEM Bar Ends to further enclose the ends because they don't appear right, and I lost some vibration dampening and the solid feeling from the bar when these were removed. I am also getting the VPS Alluminum Backbones powercoated satin black, and I jsut picked up some eBay Replacement Powdercoated Black Levers that are 5/8" shorter and fit perfectly in the VPS Backbone Enclosure.


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    Closeup - this is the side that doesn't have any interference and is properly mounted.


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    Looking at the raised area, you can see how much wind will stay off your hands.


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    And a final picture as an example of your hand in place on the grips.


    The bad news - you need to do the entire Highbar Handlebar Upgrade to get these. And I need to still purchase Hinge-style SW-Motech 40mm Mirror Wideners as these bump the mirror stalks forward an inch or so near the pivot base of the mirror enclosure portion - something I needed to do anyways when my arms went out 3 inches wider to each side. ...These swings perfectly under the fairing pocket like they were meant for the Vif!!
     
  3. Marco_at_CA

    Marco_at_CA New Member

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    That's great.

    I just got an email from a friend who told me to look into the spiegler kit.

    Thanks
     
  4. BASFjon

    BASFjon New Member

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    Custom Risers made by myself and installed - also installed a set of Foortpegs Lowering Blocks from MCL/Netters...noticed I picked up some vibration, lower legs and feet are now in the wind at higher speeds, and I sit further back in the seat... so now it looks like I might make another riser that's a little more backward and taller...

    I did resolve the fairing issue completely with the black plastic trim being cut. Considering Rizoma matching Reservoirs with a custom clutch cylinder spout adaptor for a hose to the reservoir for that side.

    Noticed I am getting some more buffeting at highway speeds, especially with a passenger, I beleive the wind-stream is getting on the underside of the helmet - therefore I need something like the MRA secondary screen that mounts on their windscreen - something to push the wind up another 2 inches. Seems like it's a lot of work and eventually I'll get it right.

    No longer updating this thread becasue a VFR with a Street High Bar is too much of a PITA to advise anyone without machining tools and the smarts to even want to do this. It's a lot of work!! But the basic Low-Bar Spiegler Kit is decent - just works the tricepts!
     
  5. mestoo

    mestoo New Member

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    Thank you! Thank you! Thank you for the useful information!

    I'm new to the Interceptor world (as in pick up my new, leftover red 07 tomorrow) coming from a Suzuki SV650 naked. As one perilously close to turning 60 and 6' 2" I'm not comfortable on a sport bike; suspect I will be looking at either Heli Bars or Speigler to get the bars a bit higher. I'm pretty sure I don't want to go through all you've done to get the supersport high bars installed, but am leaning towards the suspersport low bar installation.

    I know Gen Mars give about a 3/4 inch lift, Heli Bars give about 1 1/4 inch. Do you have a guess as to what the vertical and longitudinal displacement of the LSL Spiegler (low) bars is relative to the stock position?

    Once again, thanks for sharing the info and congratulations on a job well done.

    Bob S.
     
  6. Y2Kviffer

    Y2Kviffer Insider

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    mestoo, I had the GenMars and now have HeliBars. The HeliBars are not only taller but also come back closer to you than stock.
     
  7. BASFjon

    BASFjon New Member

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    I have a vid on youtube with the Spiegler Base Kit (Low Bar Setup). Was about 20-some degrees out, but it's a quick video and it gives some info on the install.

    If you guys wanted, I can pinpoint the start and end center location of the gripson the highbars and lowbars, but we need to find a common reference point or plane on the triple-tree, for example.
     
  8. Arno71

    Arno71 New Member

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    Via Ebay I managed to buy a LSL Spiegler highbar for a nice price was part one.
    Installing it was more difficult but using the how to's in this thread, the 3 vids on youtube and a how to on the Dutch VFR owners club forum made most of it pretty easy. Only the throttle cable gave me headaces.
    Using a drawing supplied by MDI motorparts webshop in Holland I tried to route the cables as they show. Unfortunatly it resulted in blocking the inner throttle cable in moving back to its resting position. I had to many sharp curves in the cables. Therefore I went to a local motorcycle wreckage yard to check out some other throttle cables which had 2" more length then the original 6th gen throttle cables.
    This search resulted in a Honda ST1100 (2002) Pan European throttle cable which also had a chaving protection all the length of the cable instead the 5" on the original cable.
    The ST1100 (2002) cable fits the same way as the original one without any blocking or chaving points. The thread is the same as the VFR and also the throttle wire ends fit the same!
    Some pics to show the results

    Top the original lenght, below the ST1300 ones
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    Cables routed behind the lefthand side cooling fan underneath the main frame
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    Cable routed behind the brake line, above the top of the cockpit bracket
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    cables in front of the RH forktube
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    A differnt view from the RH side
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    The final result ;)
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    Thnx to the "how to" by BASFjon live was made a lot easier, thnx for that!!
    I hope this added some to the cable issues.

    Salute
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2010
  9. deepdish

    deepdish Banned

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    you ride it yet how did it fell???? looks cool...
     
  10. Arno71

    Arno71 New Member

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    Just a short block. The roads are still loaded with salt which affect the aluminum parts of the bike. But it felt comfortable for now!!
     
  11. basscat

    basscat New Member

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    Thanks to BASFjon and Arno71 for some great info. jon I have seen your video and have bought the low handelbar kit from Spiegler. I will install this weekend I think with the low
    bar I will not have to have the longer throttle cable. Hope not anyway. I have seen someone on this site that shows the cable rerouted. I love the higher bar you did but I do not
    have the tools or the inclination to do all the work you have done. I have helibars now and am hoping that the Spieglers will be somewhat higher. As soon as I install I will put the
    Helis up for sale. Thanks again to both of you for sharing such good info.
     
  12. Andrey666

    Andrey666 New Member

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    well done BASFjon, very usefull info here, i just bought lsl kit + both (low and high) bars will see which one will fit better. One think i dont get is why dont you use one of spiegler original riser clamps instead of fabricating one. Thay have different size options and are quite cheap. See link
     
  13. Tachyon2

    Tachyon2 New Member

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    Good thread. I'm considering my options with the Speigler Superbike Low or the Street High bars. Some say the Superbike Low bars aren't a huge improvement as far as longer ride hand pressure points. It's great to read your threat on installing the high bars. So, how does feel to ride with high bars? How does the VFR handle with the different bar position? Is there a lot of cutting or mods to the fairing & windshield? No regrets?
     
  14. VFRIRL

    VFRIRL New Member

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    Typical of these threads, all the work done,guys ask for a ride report and no follow ups.
     
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