The reason for my new avatar

Discussion in 'Anything Goes' started by Samuel, Sep 4, 2018.

  1. Gator

    Gator Insider

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    This is correct. You can only do something like this with the employers permission while “on the clock”. It’s a sticky situation for the NFL. Like I said before, they chose the wrong platform and Instead of uniting it has become divisional. Especially when Trump throws gas on the fire.
     
  2. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    Another thought on Kap to throw out there. I think he's really failed and done his cause a disservice. Leaders bring people together around a cause. I don't believe he's brought new people to his cause that wouldn't already have been sympathetic to his message. Because of the means he choose to use, all he's done is drive a giant wedge between groups and made many unwilling to even consider his message (this thread as example 1). That's unfortunate for the people he was/is supposedly trying to help.
     
  3. reg71

    reg71 Poser Staff Member

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    I don't find it offensive to me and I'm a veteran. I would find it distasteful for me to do it, but I support his right to do it. I do not like others speaking as to what offends me as a veteran.

    I find wearing an American flag as a shirt or shorts or underwear more offensive. At the same time I am okay with people who wear a tasteful American flag as a pin or on a patch. Maybe that's just me, but I have a feeling a lot of veterans feel similar.
     
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  4. reg71

    reg71 Poser Staff Member

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    On another note, I'm glad it's football season and I'll choose my shoes the same way I always do. What is on sale that I can tolerate the looks of? Nuff said.
     
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  5. Nelix

    Nelix New Member

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    For once NorcalBoy and myself are in complete agreement.

    Your use of "ISIS looking MoFo" takes away any credibility from any argument you may make.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2018
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  6. cat0020

    cat0020 New Member

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    As a veteran myself, I can agree with most if not all of the quotes from these: Veterans' Views

    "I can tell you, speaking for three generations of my family, it is PRECISELY for men like Kaepernick, and his right to peacefully protest injustice, that we were willing to serve,"

    "Want to respect the American flag? Then respect the ideals for which it stands. Bullying language and calling peaceful protesters 'sons of bitches' who should be fired aren't among them."

    I have been stationed in 4 different continents around the world, I find there is a cult of ignorance among society worldwide, maybe there's always been.
    The string of anti-intellectualism has a constant thread winding its way through the political & cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy (Sometimes, cult member even disguise their ignorance as free speech.) means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge or observation obtained through scientific ways additionally backed by evidence.
    The lack of basic (quality, primary) education in America has specifically contributed this type of ignorance: Inability to see beyond each's own immediate surroundings, to consider circumstances beyond their own experience, to even imagine what common sense would dictate beyond the ideology of a different point of view.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2018
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  7. FJ12rydertoo

    FJ12rydertoo Member

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    Very well spoken. I served during the Vietnam War and was well aware of the protesters and people who went to Canada to escape the draft. I didn't do that but I understood why they did. I never considered it, but I thought those were actually some brave individuals who gave up the life they knew to support their beliefs.
     
  8. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    But the people who support what he does as an individual don’t acknowledge that he’s doing it in a uniform.

    What would your employer do if you made politically provocative and devisive statements while wearing their uniform and standing on their platform? Our company handbook specifically addresses this topic.
     
  9. Gator

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    So does every NFL contract. They need to change the platform they using, this will continue to go nowhere and be decisive. I bet they could get air time cheap or even free to get their message out.
     
  10. cat0020

    cat0020 New Member

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    Employers are entitled to do whatever they want with their employees, consequences are still to be determined by the customer who support your business.

    If an employee's protest is out of line, unfit, untrue, or does protest does not reflect reality in our society, I'm sure the protest would be in vain and employees would have nothing to worry about.

    But if protest is legit and do reflect reality in our society, employer better be able to own up to their ideals and know how to operate their business to reflect reality in our society.
     
  11. tinkerinWstuff

    tinkerinWstuff Administrator Staff Member

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    What does this mean? So if a UPS/fedex/USPS worker hangs a pro or anti gun/abortion billboard on the side of their truck, how does that shake with your statement above? I don’t understand.
     
  12. cat0020

    cat0020 New Member

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    If packages still get delivered on time and not damaged, I can careless what the driver hang on their trucks.
    If people don't like what the drivers do to their personal trucks, talk to the drivers themselves.
    As an employer, I don't want to take sides on their protest if not involving delivery of packages.
     
  13. Doug7200

    Doug7200 New Member

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    Lets take this a little father - Say an employee makes sexist...or even raciest jokes at work. You know just expressing his or her first amendment free speech rights. Some people may not find the jokes offensive, but others may!

    Would the employer be right to stop employees from telling these jokes, and be right to suspend or fire the employee if they don't? These jokes could harm the company by hurting sales or put the company at risk of being sued and held liable for damages?
     
  14. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    Thanks for the clarification, I really really briefly scanned through it so I wasn't sure. From the little I was reading, it looked like the author was making a statement something like that quote (which is a great one, IMnshO) from Teddy Roosevelt:
    “It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

    There are very few professional sports that I follow - character of those who play the games being one of the important factors. Pro football (US) and basketball are among those that I don't watch - used to watch basketball a lot when I was younger (go Celtics! haha) but no more. As far as mixing politics and sports, yeah, I guess I can see that - in kapass' case, it was just one more thing added onto everything else I don't like about the people playing and running pro football (fwiw, the sport itself, I think is a great game) - pure "chutzpah" comes to mind. For the few sports I do semi-follow, yeah, I guess I probably would prefer politics not showing up and getting in the way. The "good" thing is that I'm not immersed into anything (sports) so deeply that simply shutting off the TV and/or never watching again wouldn't be solutions for me. My family, friends, and work are all vastly more important than a bunch of zillionaires (many of them spoiled and unappreciative like kapass) running around playing any game.
     
  15. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    Fwiw, I'm not a football fan either. And also fwiw, I've experienced discrimination and racism - I did mention that I'm neither White nor Black, right - so I know what that's like and I know it still exists, even here in So Cal (which is better than a lot of other places) But you'll never see me refusing to stand for the National Anthem. Too many good people sacrificed (really sacrificed, not kapass/nike BS definition of sacrificed) for everyone living in this country for me to even begin to consider disrespecting everything they did so that we could be where we're at now. Is our country perfect? No way and believe me I'm fed up with a Lot of things. But, we've got a lot going for us and I think there's still hope.

    As far as police shootings go - funny thing is that when people comply with lawful orders and/or do Not attack LEOs, the chances for police shootings to occur drop almost to ZERO. Every "group" or "people" has a percentage of POSes, the percentages for some groups/peoples are higher than others. I'll be the first to admit that some of "my people" are POSes and are running amok doing bad things to good people and yes, some of them deserve to be shot (by the police or victims or good Samaritans, etc). That being said, most of "my people" also do Not immediately run to the defense of one of "us" who is righteously Bad and claim misconduct by LE and protest, simply because it was "one of us". Most of "my people" are Not responsible for a high percentage of crimes perpetuated upon other folks or each other. Most of "my people" are not killing each other on a continual basis, hundreds of times greater than LE interactions that resulted in death, and then turning around and having the nerve to protest the LE related deaths and ignore the ones caused "from within". Also most people (all people) are clueless when it comes to real LE work, situations, dangers, rules of engagement, etc - some just blindly listen to stories some people tell and/or what the inaccurate and/or biased media relate.

    Freedom of Speech? You know FOS is NOT carte blanche, right?
     
  16. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    I agree. kapass has a right to do or say certain things that fall within FOS. That being said, he needs to be man enough to accept whatever repercussions his actions/behaviors might have (if who he plays for doesn't like it and disciplines him for it, so be it). If who he plays for allows or condones or encourages his sayings/actions, then they should be willing to accept the same. I don't like kapass as a person and I don't like his demonstrations. I don't like the nfl for allowing those to be continued/perpetuated. I don't like nike for making him a poster boy. I have the same FOS to express how I feel about kapass and the nfl and nike (until the mods tell me I've overstepped the bounds of this forum).
     
  17. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    I'm guessing that the majority of mainstream society would be perfectly fine with equality and unity BUT certain high exposure people from certain "groups" are doing a great job of keeping things divisive.
     
  18. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    I personally find it offensive (and I've never served in the military). That being said, I don't expect everyone to share my beliefs, veteran or not, and I would not be speaking for any one else but me. I do believe that people have a right to kneel or protest - as long as it doesn't constitute the commission of a crime or otherwise interfere with other people going about their daily routines - but I reserve the right to judge and form my own opinions about those who do.

    I feel strongly about the US Flag as well and wouldn't hesitate to rescue one if I was ever around one being mistreated. I don't mind people flying other countries' flags as long as they are flying the US Flag correctly and simultaneously. I do find it offensive, though, when people intentionally put another country's flag above the US Flag or fly another country's flag solo.
     
  19. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    For sure I would be standing tall and facing the music, and not music that I like either...
     
  20. Samuel

    Samuel Member

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    Thanks for your service.
     
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