Two Bro's vs. Leo Vince?

I'm still stuck on my Leo's and here's the reason why...

First time turning the key! LINK

 

It seems as both looks and sound are so subjective, what about performance gains? I understand that I shouldn't expect much, but will one gain me more than the other (I'm also putting in a BMC and PCIII)?

I was almost sold on the Leo's till I saw the going price for the CF pipes. Almost $1000??? That's crazy! I might have to go the aluminum route. I still like the look of the 2Bro's better tho.

 

It's funny I stumble upon this thread because I'm in the same position. I get a $1000.00 Xmas bonus at work this year and that's going to a new exhaust. I keep going back and forth between TwoBros and Leo. I think my mind is made up for the Leo's. Mainly based on the sound (I think the Leo's sound better) and the look. I really don't like the look of the TwoBros. And I hate the fact that the TwoBros go to one can. I don't really know why that bothers me since the 5th gen is one can and it's not like the 6th gen is really a true dual exhaust. But different strokes for different blokes. And the Leo's do it for me. You have to go with your gut that's what your going to be happy with.

 

That's a good chunk of change, sounds like mod time to me!

I've got the Leo carbon cans with out the spuds and love the way they sound and look! The end of the cans don't go past the tail light like some other systems. They also came with a new heat sheld for the up pipe made out of carbon fiber. A nice touch.

But if your looking for an simply install and don't care for carbon than go for the Staintunes. You can't beat the build quality and with the mounting bracket already attached to the cans they are a snap.

I picked my Leo's for $720.00 + s/h from Exoticsportbikes.com. Had them in one week. Some will say bad things about ESB.com but I guess I was the lucky one.

 

Hi, reading all your comments about the leo vince and other exhausts give me mixed feelings. I bought a 2003 VFR just a few month ago and love the bike but have some ego issues.. with the sound. A dealer here in Bangkok recommended the Leo Vince (only ones he has I guess) and I tried to get some insight on VFR world. Hmm, seems like there is a balance between Two Brothers, Staintunes and Leo Vince and all of them seem to be fine so I will go for the only option I have here - the Leo Vince. I hope it will be a good surprise. I had one with another bike - a Yamaha TDM - where I struggled to make my mind up about spending money on an aftermarket exhaust. I ordered a Wolf exhaust and had it fixed at a workshop. The sound is just amazing (so incredibly different to the stock exhaust that I wonder what Yamaha had in mind when they put the stock exhaust on the bike, now there is a thumping sound that speaks of power) and I hope something similar will happen when I change to Leo Vince.
PS: I was riding with a friend who rides a fire blade and I heard him when he was 100m away. Just a powerful rumble and I hope that will be the sound my money buys..
Enjoy riding
Max

 

You can't go wrong with the Leo's. With out the db killers is the sound your looking for! I would never buy the 2Bros because of the fake pipe.

Question? Why do you have to go with what the dealer has on hand? Can't he order exactly what you want or better yet, you order and install the system you want. Switching out the exhaust system is very easy.

 

OK that's it!

Tom, we're making a side-by-side Leo VS Two Bro's pipe comparison video very soon!

 

Do it, do it now!

But, it still wont matter. A sport bike is a purpose built thing. Having a fake pipe because the bike won't look right with out it is about as useful as the fake hood scoop on the mustang. Sure it looks sporty you poser but it don't do jack!

How hard would it have been for 2Bros to make a true 2 into 2 system? They've done it for just about every other bike out there except the hondas.

You wouldn't catch a R1 owner with one fake pipe.

 

I'm eagerly watching out the window right now for the ups man because my Leo's are coming in the mail TODAY! They are going to sound SICK
:cheersaf:

 

Good morning all,

Just wnated to put my 2 cents in. While the dumby can on the vale is an oddity there is no performance loss what so ever, in fact 2bros says that it is a perormance increase. Who knows?? One thing is certain, the 2bros is lighter than the leo if that matters. Not sure where the savings are with 2bros however as I paid nearly $1000 for my titanium set up. Also I can tell you first hand the 2bros sounds sweet although the first several hundred miles the pipe spits, sparks and burbles. After that initial break in the sound is smooth and deep with just the right amount of DB and a little bit of character sparking during decel. I also agree with you in that I think the 2bros looks better. In my opinion any short can system looks the best on a 6 gen.

F.Y.I. When you do your pcIII you're going to have to install th O2 eliminator aswell or you're going to find that the stock CPU fights the PCIII and actually causes a down grade in performance. Also there is no specific mapping program for the 2bros. I used another short can map program( don't remember which ) and it did not work well. The bike ran very rich and there was a massive power drop at the VTECH transition. I ended up getting a dyno and a custom map that solved all issues and tied the pipe and PCIII togather perfectly. Withall of that and one less tooth on the front sprocket the bike no longer has any of the characteristics that are so often bad mouthed regarding the 6 gen.

Good luck!!

 

Hi Chris,

thanks for encouraging me!
Hm, you are right, there is the option to order something different then what the dealer has on hand and I can order directly.
But there are a number of factors (most of them 'convenience issues') that point towards having it sorted out by a dealer.
1. most abroad manufacturers or dealers ship to Thailand but I have to cover shipment cost, the risk that it never arrives, the potential customs rip off, potential shipment damage and the wait can be fairly long as 'unassisted' customs handling can take ages.
I ordered an exhaust from Wolf for my TDM early last year and I waited about 3 month until finally a battered box turned up at my door and some guy wanted some import duty on the spot. By then I was already fighting with Wolf as both of us assumed the other party wanted to skip the deal 'with the money'.
So, a dealer who has its connections and shipment processes makes life so much easier. In Bangkok there are quite a few garages but only maybe 3 shops I would really trust to do a good job. One of them is the one where I bought my bike but they are not really interested in this 'small stuff' and another of the good shops seems eager. Its the shop where my colleague bought his fire blade just recently and he is full of praise for the shop. Obviously I could ask them to order Staintunes etc but they are steadfast on Leo Vince, carbon.
2. doing a DIY job is difficult for me here in Bangkok. I have no garage just a small car port where my wife and I compete for the space (car versus bike - lost battle I can tell you). And I have no tools other than a screw driver... Ok ok I have a few more tools but no specialist stuff and I might run into trouble. I started changing the TDM exhaust myself and I could not do it. Bits and pieces were missing and I needed some sealing stuff that was hard to get so I took the bike and exhaust bits to my favourite shop and they did the job the same day and for next to nothing. The workshop prices are very very reasonable here! The quality is another matter though.. that's why I only trust the small number of shops here.
3. I understood that a new exhaust needs re-mapping or whatever it's called and that I definitely can not do myself. If I had the garage and the tools I would be keen to get my hands dirty and would not be scared of fiddling with the 'mapping' but at the moment I would be standing in my carport with a screw driver and a multimeter and a lost look in my face and despair in my soul..., So I better leave it to the experts at the shop (assuming they are experts..). In my case it makes sense anyway as this shop is going to change another thing anyway - my bike was restricted to 180km/h and has been opened by the shop where I bought it. Now it's riding faster but the speedo stops at 180 km/h. This shop claims they can derestrict the speedo (they did it for the fire blade of my colleague). Just in case you are wondering, the 180km/h limit is Japanese regulation and the bikes here usually are direct imports from Japan with Japanese specs.

So there are 3 points that drive my decision to use a shop even though I obviously have to pay a premium for their services.
I will order the Leo Vince today and I have a good feeling about it!

Thanks again and good riding
Max

 

OML I can't let this thread go without saying something....One word, before it's to late yea I know, you didn't ask for it, but here it is anyway STAINTUNE my friend. all others are just copy cats. Really..

 

Hi RVFR,

thanks for your last second attempt to save the world. However, I took the plunge just now and ordered the Leo Vince.
I admit the Staintunes looks good on their website and I am sure it is an excellent system. But from all the positive feedback re Leo Vince I am certain this one will be ok too. The prices for the Staintunes and for the Leo Vince are similar so it comes down to availability and ease of getting the thing. The Staintunes I would have to order myself with all the issues I listed in my earlier posting. The Leo Vince comes gift wrapped from the shop.. So I am lazy and hope for the best.
But thanks anyway!!
Max

 

Man Dalexander,
reading your reply make me glad to be living in the good old USA!

You have chosen your system wisely. Enjoy!


A note to Havcar:
Excellent write-up on the 2Bros! I have for years completly understood the science behind 2Bros hp gains through system design. They have changed more exhaust systems from two can systems to one can systems than I can count and everyone of them has significant hp gains. But I've said it before and I'll say it again, I just can't wrap my head around the fake pipe idea. All the other sysems they have changed from 2-1 can systems have looked just as good if not better w/one can. The 6th Gen wouldn't.

 

If you're trying to do an exhaust system on any kind of budget, Staintunes aren't an option based on what I've seen. Another $2-$300 for what??? That was my determining factor, no aluminum option if I remember correctly.

:unsure:

 

Hi Chris,
I will post an update when I have got the new exhaust.
Can I bother you by asking if fitting the Leo Vince system (slip on) needs resetting (mapping?)? The shop will do what is necessary but I got the impression that they think that fitting the new cans is all that's needed. I will check with Leo Vince as well but as you have fitted the systems you certainly know what is required.
PS: I am sure that living in the USA is a good thing and depending on where you live, riding a bike is exciting. But living in Thailand has it's good points too. Many things are frustrating but it's teaching me that staying easy is key to everything. And the riding here in Thailand is pure adventure (or craziness). There are only a few hundred big bikes in Thailand and I have done lots of short and long trips without seeing one. Just recently I rode 3000km around the north east of Thailand (most of it along the Mekong) and my friends and I were the only bikers we saw. The country side is spectacular and you can ride all year round (ok, the rainy season is no fun at all as the roads and the traffic are unforgiving). And you really learn how to ride a bike (knock on wood). It's not about chasing bends (you get that too) but about dodging potholes, dogs, trucks, people, vicious taxis, buses etc. and to control your bike by cruising through very very dense traffic in Bangkok, but then you come to empty country roads winding through mountains, tropical forest, paddy fields, small villages, along rivers, passing excited kids, then you stay in small guest houses where people are extremely friendly, you meet fellow (crazy) bikers and you are as happy as it gets. I guess biking has its challenges and rewards wherever you live and just doing it is what counts. So let's enjoy it.
Thanks again
Max (Dalexander)

 

Hi all, I've sold the Scorpion systems and Leo Vince exhausts to a few Board members here. The Scorpions were the best bang for the buck because they were on close out from a local distributor but I own the Leo's myself. The 2Bros were never that impressive and one customer opted to buy carbon Leo's from me to replace his 2Bros. The Leo's sound very nice and the only thing I reccomend is installing the 02 bypass plugs to get the "surging" under control.

 

Hey Dalexander,

I just installed my new Leo's last night. Your going to love them! Now my neighbor's looks have gotten even dirtier(they really hate my bike...don't really know why I guess because they are old:unsure Installation really was easy; however I had trouble fitting my license plate between the cans. I have a competitionWerks fender eliminator kit and that just barely fits. Everyone's telling me to use more spacers and that wont be an issue but I like how the cans kind of taper in ever so slightly. I think I'm just going to risk possible police harassment and alter my plate. :bootyshake2: I'm talking just a 1/4 inch.

As for remapping on a PCiii everything I have read says you don't have to do it but you will get more out of the exhaust if you do remap it. I plan on buying a PCiii but it's going to be awhile until I have the money. Until then everything running fine in the mean time.

Enjoy the new exhaust!

 

Hi kia001,
you just said that you recommend installing the 02 bypass plugs to get the surging under control when fitting the Leo Vince.
Can you explain with a few words what 02 bypass plugs are and where they are installed? I am sorry but I am a total starter as far as bike electronics are concerned.
PS: my bike is 'surging' in the sense that it uses huge amounts of petrol. In town traffic or when riding rough the tank is empty after 140 miles. When I ride like a snail then I get about 190 miles out of a tank which is ok. But in normal conditions I end up with 140 miles which is way more than the factory spec says. Ok petrol is fairly cheap now but I wonder where it goes.. When I ride with a group I usually need to fill in the most gas of the group for the same trip. Even fire blades and blackbirds need much less and they have way more power.
Thanks
Max

 

Hi ExciteBike'r,
lucky you! I will have to wait around 2 weeks if the shop guy is right or more if my luck is running out..
In some way I like what you say about your neighbors as it says something about the sound. Poor neighbors though.. Have no understanding about fun and bite their nails if somebody else has. But obviously they want you to join their life style. It's not going to happen I guess. It's a bit easier in Thailand. Nobody would ever tell you off for noise and the police is fairly relaxed about formal stuff, they just take your money ..
I am with you re saving the money for the mapping tool. The exhaust is not cheap and I will have to calm down my wife first before I can go out shopping for more stuff for my egoistic hobby. Maybe the neighbors are easier to deal with..
Enjoy your new exhaust and riding
Dalexander